Sensei's B6 rebuild and swap

[Zanzer]

^^ LOL I thought about that on my car but the transmission shifts really well so I can't see tearing into until it needs it....which is hopefully never

The fluid looked pretty good on this car so hopefully it doesn't need it either. But if it does, it will get the same treatment as the engine :thumbright:

One day I want to tear a Festy down and completely go through it. Basically like a "frame off" where I would put the shell on a rotisserie and completely repaint the whole thing and then completely restore the entire car to make it as "new" as possible (with upgrades of course )

[Zanzer]

Mini Update:

Here's a good example of why I don't fully trust the hot tanking process, and a good illustration of why I always pull the baffle out of a valve cover when I clean one.


This valve cover was previously hot tanked. Looks pretty clean at first glance





But after removing the baffle this is what you'll find





After a good cleaning with Dawn. SuperClean works very well too but Dawn makes aluminum brighter than SC so I went with it instead.





After cleaning everything and reinstalling the baffle I noticed the valve cover was really showing it's miles on the outside so I went over it with the die grinder and brush. Then I spiffied it up a bit with a can of "Mark's favorite valve cover paint" LOL





I also bolted the head to the block but the pics came out crappy so I'll get some good ones tomorrow.

[ford4life]

wow awesome build i like this alot, it encourages me alot!

[Zanzer]

^^ Thanks man! It makes me happy to know it helps rally the Festy troops! :thumbright:

[91mcnasty]

I looked for a cast aluminum color for my valve cover for like a month! After wasting 30 bucks on all kinds of different paint, I said screw it and painted it white. Every silver color I bought turned out "cowboy chrome"

[Zanzer]

^^ Yup, the "rattle can chrome" always looks a little cheap or gaudy. I'll let you in on a little secret...the paint I use is Duplicolor High Performance wheel paint It has a satin finish and and a high metallic content but it doesn't try to mimic the chrome look.

I originally started using it after I bought a can to try on the plastic valve covers on the 4.6 in my Mustang. Now everyone asks where I got the aluminum valve covers

I liked it so much I started using it on all my valve covers when I do a rebuild. It's crazy how this stuff looks more like clean cast aluminum than the actual aluminum :mrgreen:

The pic doesn't do it justice. When you lay the valve cover on the head it looks better than the head LOL

[hotrodin4me]

I use Plastic-Kote Wheel Paint No. 618.
It has a satin finish and makes the valve covers
look new.

[JohnGunn]

Since the motor needed rebuilding he opted for a little more power so we sourced a B6 from a 323 for his rebuild since it's almost a direct drop in. I didn't take any before pics of the motor during tear down but let me just say that the previous owner didn't seem worried about oil changes. Most of the rings were stuck and you could tell they either skipped or pushed an oil change or two. Luckily Mazda floods the engine with tons of oil pressure so the bearing surfaces were in decent shape.

As you know, I'm dealing with a low mileage 94 Aspire whose two previous owners, from all indications, gave little, if any, care -- a lot like the engine you are working on in this thread. From your comments, you've had to replace very few parts.

I know its not what you do, but would you care to comment about whether this engine could have profited from some form of chemical cleaning. I would love to do the kind of work you have done, especially after seeing all your great pictures, but I, for one, don't have a place where I can do it. If you were on my side of the continent I wouldn't think twice about having you work your magic on my ailing B3. But, short of that, I'm faced with turning my car over to someone I don't know and would have a difficult time trusting.

For me there are only two alternatives, try and clean up the engine by using additives, or giving up on the car and starting all over, looking for a replacement that, in addition to low mileage, has also been well cared for. In these days of $4.++ gas, it would be a rare find, indeed.

Having seen the internal condition of this engine up close, could you suggest some additive treatment that would have addressed the problems you observed? That's the path I'm about to embark upon, and would value highly your advice.

[Zanzer]

John -

I'm not sure if chemical treatment would have helped this engine. The oil rings were stuck so bad I had to almost pry them from the ring lands.



There are a few things that I've done in the past and some things that I've heard of people doing (some not so good for the engine IMO). But in any case here goes.

- You can add 8 ounces of Sea Foam to the crankcase with each oil change. This is one of the safer ways to remove gum and varnish over time. I've done this but in most cases the engine was already too far gone for it to have much benefit.

- For really bad rings; I've heard of people pulling the plugs and pouring Sea Foam into the spark plug hole to soak the rings in an effort to loosen them up (maybe ask Festyboy about this. IIRC he's suggested it on here too)

- I've heard of a product called Auto-RX and some have reported improvements after use. I've never tried it so I can't comment on it's effectiveness, and it's quite pricey and sometimes requires more than 1 treatment.

- I've also heard of people adding some automatic transmission fluid and running the car under light throttle for a short period of time to clean out the bottom end. Again, I've never tried this so I can't really comment on it. I know it's been mentioned on the board here so maybe try searching for some threads about the procedure to see what the results were.

- One last thing I've heard of is people draining the crankcase and replacing the oil with kerosine. I've even heard people say they fired the engine up for a few seconds to help circulate it through the oil system. I don't see how this can have ANY positive effect on an engine but I suppose it's an option in extreme cases. Personally, if I were to try it I think I would start out by maybe replace one quart of oil with kerosine, run the car for a little while, and then drain the oil. Maybe "rinse, repeat, and increase" as necessary.

But in any case, from what I've seen in the past I think all of these things are only "band-aids" for a motor that requires actual repair. Now, with that being said, if your motor runs fairly smooth and doesn't smoke or knock and you just want to clean some of the varnish out. The first thing I would suggest is switching to a different brand of oil with a high detergent content. I use only Motorcraft, Castrol, Havoline, or Valvoline (in that order) and the insides of my engines are always pristine clean. I can't comment on synthetic oils because I've never ran them but I've heard of great results with Mobil 1, Amsoil, Red Line, and Royal Purple.

After that I would suggest 8oz of Sea Foam in the crankcase (I've done this without any issues), or maybe try 2oz poured directly into each cylinder as suggested above (although I'm not sure what this would do as far as washing down the cylinder walls), or possibly try the Auto-Rx. This would be my conservative approach. Using ATX fluid in the crankcase would be my moderate approach, and kerosine would be the extreme approach for a quick fix on something I was probably planning on rebuilding anyway. Most of the "engine flush" products you see on the shelf at the parts store contain mostly petroleum distillates and are (IMO) are just a fancy way of doing the same things I listed.

As always though, this is just my opinion and I'm sure others have different methods and/or ideas on what works and the procedures for doing it.

[91mcnasty]

Thanks for letting me in on the secret!!!
Johngunn- run her till she blows!!!! I wouldn't try to fix something thats not broken. But there's nothing wrong with trying to clean her up a little

[Damkid]

Looking great!!

[JohnGunn]

John -

I'm not sure if chemical treatment would have helped this engine. The oil rings were stuck so bad I had to almost pry them from the ring lands.



There are a few things that I've done in the past and some things that I've heard of people doing (some not so good for the engine IMO). But in any case here goes.

- You can add 8 ounces of Sea Foam to the crankcase with each oil change. This is one of the safer ways to remove gum and varnish over time. I've done this but in most cases the engine was already too far gone for it to have much benefit.

- For really bad rings; I've heard of people pulling the plugs and pouring Sea Foam into the spark plug hole to soak the rings in an effort to loosen them up (maybe ask Festyboy about this. IIRC he's suggested it on here too)

- I've heard of a product called Auto-RX and some have reported improvements after use. I've never tried it so I can't comment on it's effectiveness, and it's quite pricey and sometimes requires more than 1 treatment.

- I've also heard of people adding some automatic transmission fluid and running the car under light throttle for a short period of time to clean out the bottom end. Again, I've never tried this so I can't really comment on it. I know it's been mentioned on the board here so maybe try searching for some threads about the procedure to see what the results were.

- One last thing I've heard of is people draining the crankcase and replacing the oil with kerosine. I've even heard people say they fired the engine up for a few seconds to help circulate it through the oil system. I don't see how this can have ANY positive effect on an engine but I suppose it's an option in extreme cases. Personally, if I were to try it I think I would start out by maybe replace one quart of oil with kerosine, run the car for a little while, and then drain the oil. Maybe "rinse, repeat, and increase" as necessary.

But in any case, from what I've seen in the past I think all of these things are only "band-aids" for a motor that requires actual repair. Now, with that being said, if your motor runs fairly smooth and doesn't smoke or knock and you just want to clean some of the varnish out. The first thing I would suggest is switching to a different brand of oil with a high detergent content. I use only Motorcraft, Castrol, Havoline, or Valvoline (in that order) and the insides of my engines are always pristine clean. I can't comment on synthetic oils because I've never ran them but I've heard of great results with Mobil 1, Amsoil, Red Line, and Royal Purple.

After that I would suggest 8oz of Sea Foam in the crankcase (I've done this without any issues), or maybe try 2oz poured directly into each cylinder as suggested above (although I'm not sure what this would do as far as washing down the cylinder walls), or possibly try the Auto-Rx. This would be my conservative approach. Using ATX fluid in the crankcase would be my moderate approach, and kerosine would be the extreme approach for a quick fix on something I was probably planning on rebuilding anyway. Most of the "engine flush" products you see on the shelf at the parts store contain mostly petroleum distillates and are (IMO) are just a fancy way of doing the same things I listed.

As always though, this is just my opinion and I'm sure others have different methods and/or ideas on what works and the procedures for doing it.

Thanks Zanzer, I had already bought some Seafoam thinking to start with that and judge the results by checking oil drain down times and engine oil pressure, measured with a real mechanic's mechanical gauge I bought for this purpose. If that fails to produce observable results I could move up to something more aggressive, maybe using ATF fluid. I even bought a quart of Mobil 1 ATF with the thought of using that.

Here is a basic question. Why could I not add some amount of ATF, say 1/2 quart or even 1 quart, and drive the car very conservatively, on short trips, no more than once a day, at slow speed, along routes carefully chosen to avoid Interstates and the pressure of traffic, over an extended time period while monitoring the results on my oil pressure gauge? ATF though thinner than the 5W-30 Mobil 1 High Mileage, I've been using, is still oil and since there are rubber seals in automatic transmissions I assume it wouldn't injure the rubber parts of my engine. Would the biggest problem be the lowered viscosity? Could that not be counteracted by going to a higher viscosity oil to compensate the thinness of the ATF?

I know how to place as little stress on an engine as possible, in fact, that's the way I normally drive. The ideal for me is to drive in such a way that the result is as efficient as possible and so that the car will last as long as possible. As you may have noticed there is nothing about speed included in my ideal. I prefer to get my thrills from a beautiful song or some random act of unexpected kindness I see from time to time.

As always though, this is just my opinion and I'm sure others have different methods and/or ideas on what works and the procedures for doing it.

So true. But, my friend Zanzer, haven't you noticed; the opinion of anyone wise enough to say, "this is just my opinion", is golden?

[FestYboy]

ok, ATF is a NO NO to use in place of oil. it offers NO lubrication and has very low viscosity (read: low oil pressure). you CAN use it as an engine flush and only as such because of the high detergent value it has.

as far as the Seafoam in the cylinders (can use MMO or ATF as well), the idea is to soak the compression rings to de-varnish them (overnight), and then blow the liquid back out of the plug holes before firing again. this worked well for the engine i did it to (the blown out liquid was black). and Zanzer, the idea is to actually wash down the walls (and rings that the liquid has to pass by).

another option is to steam clean the cylinders while the engine is running (add metered pure water to a vaccum port right behind the throttle body). this will brake any carbon build-up and that should then be blown out the exhaust valve.

[blkfordsedan]

I agree with all the various methods mensioned, but sometimes it's better to leave things alone. If the engine runs good, has acceptable oil pressure and doesn't burn too much oil or smoke too bad, I would run it until it dies. Use a quality oil and change it frequently. Eventually it will improve. I would avoid the high detergent synthetic oils. I've seen several "good running" motors that after heavy cleaning or flushing turn into worn out junk with low oil pressure and no ring seal. Just something to think about, depending on the situation.

[Zanzer]

as far as the Seafoam in the cylinders (can use MMO or ATF as well), the idea is to soak the compression rings to de-varnish them (overnight), and then blow the liquid back out of the plug holes before firing again. this worked well for the engine i did it to (the blown out liquid was black). and Zanzer, the idea is to actually wash down the walls (and rings that the liquid has to pass by).

10-4. I wasn't sure of the procedure for that but now I see that you're blowing out the excess before re-firing the engine. I understand what it's supposed to do, I just wasn't sure about it washing the oil off the cylinder walls and possibly scoring the walls or piston skirts due to lack of lubrication for a short time after cleaning.


Also, you can do the "steam cleaning" method with ATF as well. We used to do it on engines that had excessive carbon buildup (especially around the valves and chambers in the head) and it worked great. SMOKED like CRAZY but worked very well

I agree with all the various methods mensioned, but sometimes it's better to leave things alone. If the engine runs good, has acceptable oil pressure and doesn't burn too much oil or smoke too bad, I would run it until it dies. Use a quality oil and change it frequently. Eventually it will improve. I would avoid the high detergent synthetic oils. I've seen several "good running" motors that after heavy cleaning or flushing turn into worn out junk with low oil pressure and no ring seal. Just something to think about, depending on the situation.

+1

Little problems can turn into big ones quickly. That's why I say a lot of the treatments and flushes are just a band-aid. Typically they either mask the problem or make it much worse. It really depends on the condition of the engine you use it on. If the engine is just starting to get a little dirty I like to clean it over a long period of time with high detergent dino oils and maybe a little Sea Foam added too it. It takes longer but it's much easier on the system. If the engine is in such bad shape that this doesn't help then you're probably looking at tearing it down anyway and the money saved on the off the shelf "mechanic in a bottle" would be better spent towards new rings and bearings.