Recommended Oil

[Oren09]

I could've sworn there was a thread on here about oil recommendations.

I searched and couldn't find it. If it's here, direct me to it, please.


So..
I know that running a lighter oil decreases friction and can therefore increase efficiency. I was wondering just how low of a weight a B3 can be run on. My engine is over 180K and I don't want to drop 0W-10 or less in it if this isn't enough for the bearings or cylinder walls.

[blkfordsedan]

5W-30, 10W-30 or probably even 10W-40 would be OK. Due to the high miles, I would go 5W-30 Synth Blend, 10W-30 conventional or 10W-40. I would avoid 5W-20 or any full Synthetic.

[TominMO]

I'm using Castrol's High Mileage oil, either 10W30 in summer or 5W30 in winter. It is a synthetic blend. But frankly I don't really think it matters. Probably more important is a top-quality filter.

[Oren09]

Thanks.
I've been using 10w-30 house brand oil since I got the car because it was burning a lot and it got dirty from a blown head gasket.
its cleaned out now so im ready to switch to a better oil.
I'll continue with the same weight and use a part syn oil then.


Sent from my FESTIVA on Droid 2.

[Pu241]

Understand that a synthetic blend can contain as little as 3% synthetic oil to be callled a blend!

[Safety Guy]

If the oil does not say how much "blend" is in it, I suppose you could "blend" it yourself. Just add one quart of synthetic to your regular oil. That's if there's no problem in blending oils together. I don't think there is with most of them, but you'd best check first.

Karl

[blkfordsedan]

Not even Mobil 1 is a true "full Synthetic". As I understand it, the actual % blend of Synthetic stocks required to be marketed as a "full Synthetic" is pretty low as well. I guess I don't much care what the actual blend is, as long as it performs.

[getnpsi]

My b3's both were taking motorcraft 5w-20 oil. My logic is this engine stopped progressing and oil has. Ford oil is a blend too, and a good deal at walmart for what it is. This weight gets back specced into several ford engines (i know the b3 is a mazda shh read on) that get put under lots of load and work fine. A lighter oil actually keeps an engine cooler, not the other way around. At the same time since our b3 doesn't put out a lot of heat anyway, in the winter a lighter oil will help the engine reach its operating temperature easier. The 5w-20 helped to make the lifter tick go away on one engine I had. I'm going to just use 5w-30 high mileage on the b8-me as it's unknown history and I don't know much about BP bottom ends. On both aspires I had no leaks and the oil burning was a valve issue that would burn any weight oil the same amount. If you are pumping oil and don't want to tear into it just shop whatever is on sale at that point. I'd not use any 40 weight unless the middle of summer, your HLA'S will thank you.

[Zanzer]

^^ I do the same. Motorcraft 5W-20 in the winter and 5W-30 in the summer. Ford sent out a memo a few years back recommending a changeover to 5W-20. I have it somewhere if anyone is interested in reading it.

I too buy it at Wal-Mart and I figure it's win/win. It's Motorcraft AND it's usually cheaper than the other name brands :thumbup:

[JohnGunn]

^^ I do the same. Motorcraft 5W-20 in the winter and 5W-30 in the summer. Ford sent out a memo a few years back recommending a changeover to 5W-20. I have it somewhere if anyone is interested in reading it.

I too buy it at Wal-Mart and I figure it's win/win. It's Motorcraft AND it's usually cheaper than the other name brands :thumbup:

Just yesterday I bought 4 quarts of Motorcraft 5W-30 synthetic blend based on your saying your favorite brand of oil was Motorcraft. Since the inside of my engine seems to be pretty dirty, I went to Wal-Mart to buy something cheaper than Mobil 1, to use in short change intervals until the engine oil remains completely clean during the full 3,000 miles it is in the car.

I found a copy of the service bulletin here, but it doesn't list either Festiva or Aspire among the applicable models. Have I missed something?

If you had an oil pressure gauge, couldn't you use that to find out if 5W-20 worked in your engine? What percent pressure drop would you expect from changing to 5W-20? If it still remains within specs would it not be OK?

[blkfordsedan]

In theory, 5W-20 and 5W-30 should be the same in terms of cold start/cold temp performance (5W). Once the oil is at operating temp, it doesn't matter if the outside temp is 105*F or 5*F. I prefer to have the added viscosity of an SAE 30 at operating temp. There are 2 schools of thought on this. Some say that an SAE 30 is the perfect viscosity in terms of protection for an IC engine at operating temp., and an SAE 20 does not provide enough boundary layer protection. They maintain the switch to SAE20 by the OEMs was only for the purpose of increasing CAFE, and not for the betterment of engine life. Others say that you should run the thinnest oil you can that still provides adequate oil pressure, usually defined as 10psi/1000rpm. I find both arguments believable, but I decided to play it safe and stick with 5W-30. I even run 5W-30 in my '04 Mustang 4.6L, which Ford specifies should use 5W-20. IIRC, the original spec on the early 4.6L was actually 5W-30 until Ford made the corporate wide change to 5W-20...Hmmmm....I'm too old & set in my ways at this point, but I do subscribe to the idea of a 5W being better for the engine than a 10W.

Here's a good place to investigate. There's a lot of info, especially if you go through the whole series of chapters.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/

[getnpsi]

Some oils thin out or shear as they are put into hard use, usually in engines with metal timing gears. You can also look on paper that there is a range for oil weights to qualify for their numbers, meaning there is overlap between brands of 20 and 30 wt oils at temperature points. Common practice is if you were running a conventional oil that sheared down lower you might as well run a synthetic of the thinner weight and enjoy what it has to offer. It's about 40 bucks to have your oil sent out and tested.

[Zanzer]

John - They don't list the Festiva or Aspire but they include this statement to imply that it's backwards compatible; "Testing has validated this viscosity grade can be used in many previous model year vehicles". I use it in all year model vehicles I own with the oldest being a 1985 F-350 running a 460 big block and I ran it in the 68 429 in my Bronco before I sold it.

I too agree that the switch has some reasoning due to CAFE numbers (the original Ford memo actually states this as well) but I also noticed a change in oil clearance specifications around the same time as the original TSB/memo. If you look at the older specs for 302 main bearing oil clearance you get anywhere from .0025 to .005. But sometime in the early 90's (around the time of the introduction of the 4.6) I noticed that this number fell to .0008-.0015, which I find oddly coincidental since the 4.6 is spec'd .0011-.0027. The old 302 clearances are actually out of spec when compared to a newer engine even though the design is the same (only the oil clearances have changed). Now, if you look at the clearance specs for a B3 you'll see that it's .0009-.0017 which is extremely close to the 4.6 and "new" production 302 numbers.

I run the 4.6 in my Mustang HARD, I'm talking "drive it like you stole it" hard. I've been into the top end 4 times for various cam upgrades and the engine is always clean as new and the cam "bearing" journals are always immaculate. Oiling is very important on a 4.6 because the cams are the highest moving part in the engine and typically the last to see lubrication. Part of the switch to 5W-20 on the 4.6 was due to premature cam failure in some cars. With the tight tolerances and cam locations they weren't seeing lubrication fast enough. Now, with that being said, the B series also shares this design. Both have the cam(s) mounted at the highest point in the system and neither have cam bearings inserts. So I figure since it's doing such a great job in my 4.6 it should do equally well in my 1.3 since they share very similar tolerances and design. I made the switch 4 years ago and have no issues to report since.

Also, another reason I like Motorcraft oil is because Ford tends to hold their products to a higher standard and doesn't settle on the bare minimum performance to meet the specification and certification. He's an excerpt from an article explaining Ford's test method:

Everybody wants to speculate that it is only for CAFE reasons that Ford specs this light weight oil. After reviewing the test criteria, you should understand that there is a lot more to Fords spec than CAFE. It has to do with deposits, viscosity breakdown/ thickening, and valve train wear.

Let me first explain the Sequence IIIF criteria. It is a test that evaluates oil thickening, piston deposits, and valve train wear under high speed, high temperature conditions. Test length is 80 hours ( or roughly 2 weeks), and max viscosity increase is 275%.

Now, what does that mean in regards to the 153-H oils that we are considering using and Fords requirement to use it? Ford has established requirements that exceed API SL/GF-3 standards set by API. Ford requires either a DOUBLE lenght Sequence IIIF or a DOUBLE length Sequence IIIE test with maximum viscosity increase of 200%. API Sequence IIIF requires 80 hours and a viscosity increase of 275% max while the Sequence IIIE requires 64 hours with a viscosity increase of 375% max. Ford requires the test time table to be DOUBLE and max viscosity increase of 200% only. Much tighter and higher standards and harder to meet than regular dino oils or synthetics. Ford also requires a limit of 30mg high temp deposits for the double lenght test compared to API SL limits of 45mg for single test length. So you can easily see that the oils meeting this standard are pretty darn tough.

In regards to Motorcraft Oil specs, the pour point is -49F, Flash point is 435F, Viscosity at 100C is 8.5 (9.30 is a 30W, so it is almost a 30w or a heavy 20w), Viscosity index is 147. The HT/HS rating (directly related to bearing and ring wear) is 2.78.

I also see folks attempting to justify the use of a synthetic thinking it is better in this weight oil. Mobil One has a HT/HS rating of 2.6 which is absolute minimum to stay within the Ford spec. Obviously, it is the bottom of the barrel as other "blends" exceed M1. When selecting your 5w-20 oil, I would suggest looking for one that has a higher than minimum HT/HS rating. Most of the "blends" are higher than minimum and most now contain moly which is a good barrier lube.

There has been questions in regards to high heat environment. I can't imagine that many folks live in a hotter area than I do. We have on average 45 days of over 115F, over 90 days of over 110F heat. My 4.6 sits and idles with the A/C running all day- it's too hot to let the truck heat up inside as the A/c will never cool it down. I have had no oil related problems and my oil analysis come back with very low, single digit wear metals. Using the 5w-20 oils in a high heat environment is fine.

I switch to the 5W-30 in the hot months for the extra insurance because I run my cars so hard. The important number IMO is the 5W rating for cold startup.

I have a copy of the original Ford memo somewhere but I'm having trouble locating it. I have 2 external HDD's, one 500GB and a 1TB so it's buried somewhere. If only I was as organized with storing my info as I am when working on a car LOL

It's not a TSB, it's a short memo explaining some of the reasoning behind the switch to a lighter weight oil. I'll post it up as soon as I can locate it.

[Zanzer]

Here's a link to the original memo if anyone is interested. I think the comment about "optimum fuel economy" would be the reference to CAFE standards since they went to the trouble of putting it in bold type LOL


http://www.ilma.org/resources/ford_2...mendations.pdf

[getnpsi]

Most people will still go buy supertech 10w-30 after all this pro-20 weight discussion. It's a good oil too, and 10w-30SN is at a much higher standard than oils that were around when b3's were in production almost 30 years ago. They will ALL work in other words but you can surely get away with lighter if desired. Just don't go thicker with noisy clogged HLA's.

Nice! As i was thinking already we aren't comparing apples to oranges using ford data on ford engines trying to apply to mazdas. Its apples to pears? As shown above the tolerances are similar. There are other makes that want a 30 wt and that is exactly what you do.

I don't like mobil1. I'll wait for rebates and sales for something else when i can. I actually pour diesel engine oil more often than I've used mobil1 in turbo cars, no ill effects.