Small European Car

[DriverOne]

Scion iQ? Why are they more expensive here than in Britain?

[TominMO]

Scion iQ? Why are they more expensive here than in Britain?

Toyota thinks we will pay this much for them.

[DriverOne]

You know, it'd be awesome to find a loophole to rebuild Festivas. The blueprints are... Well, they're not making Festivas anymore. If you could make one for $5K new and sell it as, say, an exact copy of a "classic" then maybe you'd sell a few thousand before the government shut you down for "building dangerous cars (killing the new-car market)"

[sketchman]

That's a nice idea. But then, it'd be insured as a kit car wouldn't it? Isn't that kind of insurance really high?

I wonder. How far can you take the term "rebuild"? Full restos on classics often may as well have been totally new cars. So, if we have valid VINs, how much of the original car has to be there for it to be considered the original car?

[Darlo]

http://www.scionnation.ca/scion/vehicles/iq/features-benefits/performance

I am so happy they arent throwing the Yaris' engine in the IQ! It has a Continuously Variable Transmission (CVT) and is said to get over 5.1L/100kms (46mpg).

I bet I could get WAY over 50mpg in that thing! I am excited! (I will stick with the Festiva for a while yet, lol, but later, maybe in 2014-2015, I will get an 2-year old IQ!)

[sketchman]

Again, they miss the point.
What are 16" wheels and a $16k price tag doing on a car made to be economical and tiny?

I would love to sit down with the apes producing these cars and state very seriously, "Please just explain to me how what you're doing makes any sense." Price it cheap enough and people WILL buy it even without it being stuffed full of gadgets. Why can't they understand that?

I emailed Tata Motors asking if they are ever planning to bring their cars to the US.

[sketchman]

Thank you for contacting TATA Motors and for your interest in our company and products.

At the present time, TATA Motors does not have any plans to bring our products to the US market.

[DriverOne]

Sketchman, I believe that Scion has an idea with their custom idea, but it's time to go backwards. We need a car that is built for the aftermarket, starting with a safe, small shell stripped of all options except stereo wiring and heat/AC. Double DIN radio slot with the divider. Exterior body panels are interchangable like Saturn could have been. See where I'm going with this? I'd even be ok with Ford producing them if they would "get it" and sell them for ~$4,900-$7,000. In both hatchback and sedan models. Hell, even an MR sport model.

[sketchman]

Sketchman, I believe that Scion has an idea with their custom idea, but it's time to go backwards.

I agree. They just don't seem to ever get it.

[DriverOne]

Maybe something like this?

[Safety Guy]

I just saw another GEM electric car at OSU today. It is one of the "slow speed/low range" ones but they seem to do well enough for short commutes. It had a set of newer looking Yoko 165/70-12s on it. The electric car folks recognize the value of having low mass rolling bits on their low mass cars. Why can't the "economy car" designers see that?

Consider today's economy:

-Many of the newer jobs offer lower wages and lesser (or no) benefits compared to the past.
-Credit has become harder to get.
-Costs of basic goods, including food and fuel, have gone up.
-Environmentalism is supposed to be a new trend. "Using less" is one tenet.
-Many of the poor folks will be driving old cars, many of which are not particularly "safe" or "economical."

Just as in the past, we could use some technology applied to make things better for those who just want "basic transportation."

Think of the Weimar Republic and the "People's Car" (Volkswagen, 1930s Germany).
Think of the threat the VW and other cheap European imports posed to the UK car industry and Sir Alec Issigonis' response: the Mini.
Think of the "energy crisis" in the U.S. in the seventies and the new crop of smaller cars that was spawned by that era: Pintos, Vegas, Chevettes, etc.


In today's economy, do any of the following make sense?

-15, 16 and even 17" wheels and tires
-bells and whistles out the yingyang
-premium this and that
-state of the art automated technology to do things that drivers should do themselves (back up cameras, hands free phone links, etc.)
-insisting on top notch safety technology to sell to people who CAN'T AFFORD IT, so they keep driving their old cars...

Don't make no sense to me.

Consider just this one factor:

Twelve and thirteen inch tires weigh less, cost less, use less raw materials, are easier to handle, cheaper to ship, store and keep in stock, and they tuck in better under fenders to blend with aerodynamics.

Just that one factor. Small tires make a lot of sense for entry level cars for folks who don't have a lot of dough.

But I guess they ain't fashionable!

Karl

PS: A quote page for Alec Issigonis:

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/a/alec_issigonis.html

And from Wiki on the man:

"However, at the end of 1956, following fuel rationing brought about by the Suez Crisis, Issigonis was ordered by Lord to bring the smaller car, XC/9003, to production as quickly as possible. By early 1957, prototypes were running, and by mid-1957 the project was given an official drawing office project number (ADO15) so that the thousands of drawings required for production could be produced. In August 1959 the car was launched as the Morris Mini Minor and the Austin Seven, which soon became known as the Austin Mini. In later years, the car would become known simply as the Mini. Due to time pressures, the interconnected suspension system that Issigonis had planned for the car was replaced by an equally novel, but cruder, rubber cone system designed by Alex Moulton. The Mini went on to become the best selling British car in history with a production run of 5.3 million cars. This ground-breaking design, with its front wheel drive, transverse engine, sump gearbox, 10-inch wheels, and phenomenal space efficiency, was still being manufactured in 2000 and has been the inspiration for almost all small front-wheel drive cars produced since the early 1960s."

[DriverOne]

Safety Guy, I entirely agree, although the picture I posted had none of those things. Oops. I honestly believe that a new car company is the ONLY way to make this happen. Ingenuity is best carried out by individuals in the private sector, and as we've discovered, large corporations are not the way of the future, because their concepts are largely generalized and somehow more expensive (With all the creature comforts you can stand, sans the automatic coffee cup) than anyone can afford in a short time or at all. I've seen the car lots in Jersey where they store the imports before shipping them across the country. A sea of metal that nobody will buy. Did anyone know that Subarus were sold right beside tractors in the countryside in Britain when they first came out |Top Gear|? That sounds like an idea...

[sketchman]

We do need a new company here. Have for a while. Someone posted something about the Edison 2 Very Light Car, either here or another forum. I don't remember now, but it was a great start. Don't know what ever happened to it, though. Think I'll email them.

http://www.edison2.com/

[sketchman]

WooHoo! Hopefully somethings happening here.

http://www.edison2.com/blog/2011/4/13/its-official.html

Edison2 is now officially a car manufacturer.

[DriverOne]

Wowwwwww, that's not what I expected at all!