festy weight

[anthony h]

In my area, we have a local short track, There is a division called pure 4 that requires the car to be stock with a cage and safety equipment. My question is, how much weight can i cut from a festiva? the car can weigh 21 lbs per horsepower and i want to be as close to that as possible.

[Bert]

These cars are pretty meager for superfluous weight already unless you happen to have an LX with power mirrors, AC, power steering pump and rear wiper.
Smaller battery is a start as with pulling out seats and carpets, heater. Now if you could figure out a way to get rid of all the heavy glass (the back hatch is no lightweight) you'd have something. If you're saddled with 21 lb/hp that entitles you to about 85 horsepower providing the rollcage is not a boat anchor. I'm told a B6 is essentially a bored out B3. Perhaps you can disguise one of these engines to appear to be a B3. Aspire B3 heads have roller rockers (which ought to get you a few more horses). I don't know what kind of speeds you can achieve on a short track but maybe swapping in an Aspire tranny (lower gears) will buy you some better acceleration. The operative word is 'outwardly appears to be stock'. Smokey Unik (sp?) used to dip all of his Indy car body parts in acid to thin the metal and when that was discovered he took to making slightly scaled down cars. There was serious money at stake and he didn't like to lose.
I slalom raced many years ago and very soon discovered that driving skills are much more important than devoting every working minute and dollar to trying to shave weight and boost power.
And also don't forget your main objective is to 'Have fun'.

[Festy46]

There is no amount of cutting you can do without destroying the integrity of the unibody that would get you down to that weight. The maximum hp for the fuel injected Festiva is 63. So 63 hp multiplied by 21 lbs equals 1323 lbs. About the only thing you can cut is the interior sheet metal of the doors and the hatch so that you only have the outside "skin" left. You can remove some of the bracing from the under side of the hood, too. You can also remove the alternator and replace it with an idler pulley, but you will need a good battery and to always remember to charge it before every race. Remove the windshield wiper motor and all the linkage. Remove all unnecessary wiring harnesses. Remove the whole dash and replace it with a small metal box to hold your gauges. If your rules don't require an emergency brake, you can remove that and all the parts of it.
If the track doesn't have a maximum new year i.e. "no cars newer than 1998" or something to that effect, you're not going to be competitive against these newer cars. They just have too much hp right from the factory. We went to a track a few years ago to run in their first race ever for 4 cylinders. We finished second behind a 2004 Cavalier.
The reason we did that good was because of our experienced driver running against a field of mostly rookies since it was the first race at that track. When they interviewed the driver, he bragged that his car was "bone stock". That's right "bone stock" with 140 hp.

[blkfordsedan]

I agree, the heavier and more powerful cars will be able to get down to minimum weight and 21Lb/HP without much trouble. Your car is too light to start and not enough HP. Bert has a good point. I would run a B6 longblock & ECU with the B3 intake & exhaust manifolds. It would be next to impossible to tell, and you'll be right around 75-80HP. You can then do typical weight reduction like everyone else and get down to around 1600Lbs and 21Lb/HP. Technically, maybe it's cheating (although it would be a stock motor with no performance parts). But realistically, you'll just barely be competitive and won't have any real advantage over anyone else. In fact, I would bet the top 5 cars in your class will be putting out more than their rated HP.

[TominMO]

If you run a cat delete pipe and advance the ignition, that is probably worth 15 HP right there. If you can sneak a B6 in there and do the above, you're looking at about 100 crank HP.

Here is the pipe I had in mind--looks like a catalytic converter, but is really just a straight-through pipe:

http://www.siliconeintakes.com/index.php?cPath=10&osCsid=e0ae8d6e45ab1415b3d3937e2582abd8

[Damkid]

:shock: i'd have to put my festiva on HUGE diet to even get close to 1323lbs!! it's currently around 2100lbs but with ~200hp at the flywheel, i'm not complaining lol

[Skrapbob]

If you run a cat delete pipe and advance the ignition, that is probably worth 15 HP right there. If you can sneak a B6 in there and do the above, you're looking at about 100 crank HP.

Here is the pipe I had in mind--looks like a catalytic converter, but is really just a straight-through pipe:
http://www.siliconeintakes.com/index...d3937e2582abd8

I searched the forum all day yesterday looking for this pipe. What is the correct diameter for a stock festy exhaust?

[blkfordsedan]

I suppose it depends on the track rules. Here, they won't let you on the track with a cat. Too much of a safety hazard. I've never ran in the compact class, however, so maybe its different. Come to think of it, I don't even know what they do for EFI cars, LOL.

[anthony h]

the main reason im considering a festy, is because i have almost a complete car with no title to use. The track is pretty small, and requires a car to handle good more than to have alot of horsepower. the car would basically be a shell with a cage. i think with the rite wheel/tire combo and some old school handling tricks it mite work. the b6 idea sounds good but im new to festivas, so im not up on all this. i could also cut the flywheel down alot to make the engine rev quicker. how much would a b6 cost?

[Bert]

Track judges won't know a B3 from a B6 providing you don't use a Mazda-script valve cover and don't shine the motor up too much. B6s (1.6 litre) VS Festy/Aspire B3 (1.3 litre) are common to 80s-90s 323s and Proteges. The MX3 B6 versions have 4 valves per cylinder and would be difficult to disguise.
I wouldn't be toying with flywheels too much, likely confuse the ECU.

[Ghost]

sounds like cheating to me

[TominMO]

I searched the forum all day yesterday looking for this pipe. What is the correct diameter for a stock festy exhaust?

The smallest pipe this company makes is 2". You can use this size on the 1 3/4" Festy pipe by using reducers, which are available in the exhaust section of any McParts store. You may have to get creative, i.e. using a couple of reducers, and cutting off parts of them to get just what you want. Not difficult if you have a sawzall. Then weld or clamp it all together.

[Festy46]

We make our own exhaust pipe by first getting a piece of 3/8" plate and using a drill and hole saw cut holes in it to fit the exhaust manifold. Then take some measurements and go to a muffler shop and have them bend a pipe to fit your application. The best thing to do is to make the part that is going to attach to the exhaust flange a little long. That way when you get the pipe home you can place it on the car and cut the end off to keep the pipe up as close to the bottom of the car as possible. Weld the pipe to the flange. Make sure you have the exhaust exit out the back or out under the middle of the car. Don't put the exhaust out the side. If you put the exhaust out the side, a driver you are trying to pass on the track can hear you coming better and block you from passing.

[Bert]

Ghost: you think anybody ever won a lo-ball competition by playing perfectly straight and being absolutely honest? Inventiveness, ingenuity and stretching the rules is what keeps those car race games alive, and interesting, and why race officials continue to keep making more rules. Luckily this fellow is entirely constrained by limitations of 1 horsepower per 21 pounds. Hopefully track officials weigh and dyno all of the entrants. Chances are they don't. How our lad achieves that on a meagre budget ought to be entirely his own business.
That's why they have invented race categories with specific factory cars (like Neons) so as to ensure a level playing field. You don't get to use your own car and you don't get to tinker with it. Now that is what I call fair.

[Festy46]

To paraphrase what the tech guys said at one track we ran at: "There are too many different make and model 4 cylinder cars to tech everthing on everyone of them", so they just gave up.