Fuel advisory for cold climates

[Bert]

My car has been very slow to start at cold temperatures as of this year. It's a an EFI meaning you don't have to pump the gas pedal when you turn the key. I noticed recently that 'regular unleaded fuel' pumps at the Filling Stations have a disclaimer attached that says 'may contain up to 5% ethanol'. Whatever is going on I decided to invest in a tank of Premium (no ethanol at all) this time around when the tank was dry. -18 C (pretty close to 0 F) this morning and the car started on the first turn like it is supposed to, and always has. Supposed to become much colder over the next few days and I will report back on how well the car starts under those circumstances. Festys were designed and engineered before ethanol additives came out and the primitive ECU may not adequately recognize the stuff (ethanol blends) when it adjusts/computes fuel mixtures.

[TheresGabe]

Umm... by law in my state all gas now contains at least 5% ethanol, and during the winter most contains 10%. It's delightful. And I get to watch my mileage drop 5MPG when it happens!

Edit: Just went back and read the facts. All normal gas stations in the US MUST have Ethanol. It was an act of Congress in 2010.

Here is an article about the change in Utah http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=11014069

[Movin]

This is dangerous and not recommended but with a lot of precaution some have been known to pull there injectors and with all hooked up make sure they have a nice fine spray when the engine is cranked. While the injectors are out look in the holes and see if everything is shiny clean...carbon soaks up fuel like a charcoal briquette when you first try to start it. After you shut it off it evaporates all the fuel it stores...to cause more problems.
Clean everything. Check compression, readings near 100 psi don't like to start very good and any lower will idle poor as well.
The volatility of the fuel is what maters here, how easy it starts on fire. Fresher the better.

[Bert]

This is dangerous and not recommended but with a lot of precaution some have been known to pull there injectors and with all hooked up make sure they have a nice fine spray when the engine is cranked. While the injectors are out look in the holes and see if everything is shiny clean...carbon soaks up fuel like a charcoal briquette when you first try to start it. After you shut it off it evaporates all the fuel it stores...to cause more problems.
Clean everything. Check compression, readings near 100 psi don't like to start very good and any lower will idle poor as well.
The volatility of the fuel is what maters here, how easy it starts on fire. Fresher the better.

I doubt that grade of fuel is the sole reason for sluggish starts when it's cold but so far it has been an 'easy fix'. The Ontario gas pumps for 91 octane say right on them; "contains no ethanol". My car is black inside the engine from the former owner and had burnt valves when I bought it and uses about a quart of oil every 1000 miles. Mileage is also getting up there for a car that was strictly a grocery getter for 15 years and 125,000 mi and then went 100K more as a courier vehicle and long distance commuter for me.

[bravekozak]

Sunoco sold their Ultra 94 to Petro-Canada. This gas was intended for the older high compression engines, but is still available at select stations. It is considered the fourth grade of pump gas.

[sketchman]

Oops. I goofed.

[B3Festiva]

Re: Fuel advisory for cold climates

I use ultra 94 lol works wonders i can epically tell the difference.

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk 2

[stonemaster]

not all gas station are all ethanol gas, go to http://pure-gas.org/

[Bert]

Two days in a row it has been -18C (close to 0F) in Ottawa and are forecast to be even colder over the next few days. I have never had problems (aside from reduced output from batteries) starting my EFIs in cold weather up until this year. Carefully checking the disclaimers on gas pumps yesterday (Ottawa, Ontario, Canada) has been quite informative; Ethanol blend-specific (up to 10%) gas pumps have recently been discontinued and now there are only 3 fuel choices. Regular (87 octane), mid-range (89) and Premium (91). Regular now says it "may contain up to 10% Ethanol", Premium contains none, and Blend is a 50:50 mix of Regular and Premium (ie 5%). In previous years the Regular grade gas only contained "up to 5%". I'm guessing because of this the ECU of 20 year old cars cannot adequately adjust fuel mixtures and are consequently more difficult to start when it's cold. Ethanol is not known for being very volatile at low temperatures.
I filled up with Premium last week in anticipation of this cold snap and both days so far the car has started like a champ. As opposed to previous occasions over the past month when I was running Regular and had to turn the engine over for 5-10 seconds before she'd fire.
From this informal test I would venture a guess that everyone can improve their cold-starts merely by switching to Premium (or no Ethanol) during cold snaps.

[Bert]

This is the second day in a row (over and above 'balmy' 0 F days) that temperatures have dipped well below 0 F (-8) and yet the car (93 EFI) has started beautifully. If you are a rust-belt Festy owner (or anybody with a 20 year old car) and still DD one of these pre-ethanol-blend cars do yourself a big favour and fill up with Premium-grade gas whenever there is a forecast of sub-zero temperatures.
My poor old 86-Carbed truck refused to start in real cold, with 5% Ethanol, already 15 years ago and I learned to switch it over to 'pure gas' during cold snaps. Now that Regular fuel (in Ontario) is further dliuted down to 10% E my Festy has suddenly afflicted with slow starts.

[Movin]

Maybe they should back off the corn sqeezins during the coldest times
and make it out of pop corn instead, for a kicken start!!

[Bert]

Maybe they should back off the corn sqeezins during the coldest times
and make it out of pop corn instead, for a kicken start!!

You would think that gov'ts and testing laboratories would thoroughly evaluate new fuels under all conditions. I can just imagine the folks up in Iqaluit (E kal oow it) and Yellowknife cursing and swearing at vehicles that don't start at -40 F. I have a buddy that lives up that way and thanks to thermostatically-controlled remote starters they now don't have to leave their vehicles running non-stop when they're out in the tundra; as soon as the oil (or antifreeze) temperature dips to a certain number the vehicle re-starts and warms up for a pre-determined period of time before shutting off again. White gas-fired engine heaters have been outlawed for in-town use simply because they've caused too many accidental fires.

[lessersivad]

There IS a way to get the ethanol out.

Being ethanol is hygroscopic it's possible to remove it by adding water, after a 24 hour or overnight "settling" period, the water/ethanol can be drained from the bottom or the gasoline can be siphoned from the top.

Unfortunately the octane rating of the fuel will propbably be lower due to the ethanol being used as an octane enhancer.

This would become quite a project, but it could be done.

[Bert]

There IS a way to get the ethanol out.
Being ethanol is hygroscopic it's possible to remove it by adding water, after a 24 hour or overnight "settling" period, the water/ethanol can be drained from the bottom or the gasoline can be siphoned from the top.
Unfortunately the octane rating of the fuel will propbably be lower due to the ethanol being used as an octane enhancer.
This would become quite a project, but it could be done.

Novel thinking but I strongly suspect that ethanol stays in solution with gasoline whether it has bound with water or not. The old-fashioned under-carb glass fuel bowls (with drain) would trap water though.

[lessersivad]

Novel thinking but I strongly suspect that ethanol stays in solution with gasoline whether it has bound with water or not. The old-fashioned under-carb glass fuel bowls (with drain) would trap water though.

The formula I found, though I personally haven't tried it, is for 20 litre of E10 gasoline add 5 litre of water and shake. This mix supposedly "binds" the ethanol and water together which settles to the bottom.

This info is from a fellow in OZ that claims he no longer has problems with his small engines' fuel systems.