top end rattle, anyone run a B3 without the valve cover on?

[Larry Hampton]

So I took off work today to try and get Thing 2 running. Now it looks like the valve cover will have to come back off. I started it up and it had a slight rattle, shut her off. Check timing, oil level, hmmm .8 low. I have no idea when the oil was changed last, and I don't have a quart of anything laying around, hey how about that jug of used oil?

Pour in about .8 and start it up, sounds better........ uh-oh, shut her off.

The back story is it got overheated, so the head was resurfaced. Now the reason it sold was because the cam retainer was never bolted down. The cam walked forward and disengaged the distributor. I grabbed all the rockers, they seemed tight. I've never messed with the top end of an OHC.

[TDI_ftw]

Mine was running on 3 cylinders when I bought it, one of the bolts on the intake rocker was backed out. The shaft broke on #1 and didn't allow the intake valve to open, the rocker shaft broke off at the 2nd bolt as well. Retaped the thread and used a longer bolt, works like a charm now.

[Zanzer]

I have no idea when the oil was changed last

I'd look into changing the oil if you're unsure of it's current mileage. HLAs are notorious for rattling on startup and they like good clean oil. Many times an oil change will make the noise go away.

[Larry Hampton]

Well, he tore it down, I figured when he put it back together, he put new oil in it.

The oil looked pretty clean. Not like the used I put back in.

This is pretty loud.

[Zanzer]

It ran fine before you did the cam retainer and after you put the VC back on and fired it you got the rattle correct?

How long had you ran it previously? (total time with the new head) How long did you let it run today? Sometimes they have to run a little while before the noise goes away. My white 93 tried to develop the "rattle" once and I had to run it for about 10 minutes or so before it quietened down.

[Larry Hampton]

I bought it not running, it ran for 3 weeks after the head resurfacing as per the PO.

It sat for probably two months after it died.

I was thinking since Oreillys has the buy 2 get 1 free on Seafoam, changing the oil in both cars and adding some Seafoam. I'll add another can to this car's first fill up.

[Zanzer]

I would only add 8oz to the oil change. A whole can (16oz) may risk thinning the oil or effecting lubrication.

I was going to suggest that maybe they got the rocker rails switched when they did the head which would block the oil feed holes in the rails, but if it ran fine after the head job I'd assume the rail swap issue is less likely. If the car has sat for a while some of the HLAs may have leaked down and will be noisy on startup until they pump up again. That's what happened on my 93. She sat for about 6 months and when I fired her up again she had a clatter for about 10-15 minutes until everything pumped back up.

[Larry Hampton]

I have no idea if it ran fine after the head job or not, but based on the missing cam retainer bolt, a busted off bolt in the V/C that holds the air box on, lower filter box bolts missing, a water pump pulley bolt missing, a broken VAF plug and a broken TPS plug, I wouldn't be surprised if it's put together wrong.

So let it idle for 15 minutes or so and see what happens?

[Zanzer]

That would be the easy thing to try first but based on what all the things you just posted I wouldn't be surprised if they got the rocker rails swapped. There's an oil feed hole in the center of each rail that is fed by a gallery in the head. If you swap the rails it blocks this hole.

Actually, I'd be surprised if they got them right LOL

[Larry Hampton]

Well, if I have a 50/50 chance of being right, I've typically found my first choice to be 95% wrong. I guess I'll go pull the cover....

Now if I do, it'll be fine and some run time will fix it.

If I don't, the damn thing will seize up and send shavings into the rod and main bearings and totally screw up my day.

[Zanzer]

Hahahah, I totally feel ya bro! Murphy is my co-pilot too

Even if they're swapped it takes a little while for it to wear and usually it just hurts the rails and mostly the aluminum rocker. I've pulled them apart where they've been swapped and ran for quite a while without major issues such as shavings and the like.

[91mcnasty]

It could be worse!

[Zanzer]

^^ It can ALWAYS be worse. For examples just check out my "Gallery of car death" on Facebook :laughing6:

[Larry Hampton]

I think I figured out what's causing the rattle...



This is a closeup of the second hole from the left on the bottom.



no threads. Time-sert or Helicoil time.

Do you see the witness marks of the springs? Is that normal?

[Zanzer]

No that isn't normal. Did they have the spring in between the head and rail? That would give you too much valve lash and and cause it to rattle. The springs are supposed to butt up against the saddle of the head, not be bolted in between the head and rail. That would throw your geometry way off.

I've got a couple of head that are stripped like that. I'm going to try to drill and tap them to the next size up when I rebuild the heads. Those rails only torque to 14-19lbs (IIRC) and I've seen a lot of instances where people have "monkey fisted" them as I call it. They just crank down on it with their big dawg crab arms and the result is what you have.