Running too rich? Adjust idle faster due to that?

[bobstad]

About two weeks ago, I ran into a young man with an amazing '88 Mazda 323; with over two hundred horsepower and constant four-wheel drive.

He'd noticed my Festiva late one night at a local club The Shakedown here in town; where I've taken to going on Thursdays as part of my weekly night on the town, when there aren't too many cover charges or people, so kind of mellow. I even shun ginger ale for a glass of water. Then he'd been without the Mazda who showing interest in the Festiva got me to pop the hood; the first time anyone has shown much of an interest in my car, willing to tell me about that. Soon we were talking about my car, while he also showed me some photos of his hot Mazda on a phone or other type device. Later we gave each other rides in our respective vehicles.

This fellow seems very knowledgeable, and soon was trying to reset the idle speed on my car; claiming the wet fuel in the tailpipe means my car is running too rich, setting the idle up a little will cure. Using the screw setting under a removable rubber or plastic plug, on top of the plenum air intake just in front of the fuel injectors...without getting out of my chair tonight after dark and looking-that's pretty accurate.

I'm still very vague on how setting the idle up will make the motor run leaner; though not a bad plan generally as the motor even when warm, can stop running almost after a long drive on the freeway, standing idling at a stop light. I did set the timing and idle speed using a timing light and tachometer; so that I'm "by the book" though making the idle a little faster seems like a not too bad an idea, considering how easily the car now can need a little blip of the gas pedal to stay running. Nothing really even all that annoying, if so simple seeming to alter I'm wondering why not; and particularly since advised to do so by someone else who seems to know: While I'm wishing, I knew what exactly is going on?

[jtugfestiva]

Thats the idle set screw. If you set it a little high your car will run at a higher RPMs thus burning more fuel. This screw doesn't adjust the fuel or air mixture since the car is electronically controlled. Ive adjusted mines to 900rpms to adjust with the common or intermittent low idle of these cars after having so many miles on them. Adjust the engine idle speed while car is running at normal operating temps. That should give you an accurate adjustment. Check all your vacuum hoses too which could affect idle speed. Hope this helps

[bobstad]

Thats the idle set screw. If you set it a little high your car will run at a higher RPMs thus burning more fuel. This screw doesn't adjust the fuel or air mixture since the car is electronically controlled. Ive adjusted mines to 900rpms to adjust with the common or intermittent low idle of these cars after having so many miles on them. Adjust the engine idle speed while car is running at normal operating temps. That should give you an accurate adjustment. Check all your vacuum hoses too which could affect idle speed. Hope this helps

Sounds like I'm best keeping the car as is, or maybe idling just a small amount faster because of the age of the car and miles involved with about 180,000. Also seems as if resetting the idle will have nothing to do with the lean or rich running of the car; except as stated, using more gas if set high. My adviser acted so sure of himself; while I couldn't image why his recommendation would work as he stated?

I'm just curious now, if wetness inside the tail pipe on a cold night after just starting the car, which had sat awhile; is really any reliable indication the motor is running too rich? I've had people tell me Festivas generally run a little rich; while this other person's Mazda is such a built vehicle, I'm wondering what sort of character I may be dealing with. Only twenty-one years old; though apparently very savvy about cars, at least his Mazda and my Festiva a little. My car runs excellent, by the way.

[blkfordsedan]

Bob, don't let him mess with your car again. That moisture in the tail pipe is not fuel, LOL, it's water...and that's good. The mixture is perfect, and the water is a combustion by-product of a proper mixture. Pretty much impossible to have raw fuel puddling in the tailpipe and have the engine still be able to run, let alone run well. Even so, adjusting the idle speed has zero to do with fuel mixture. This is a sign that the Mazda kid knows enough to be dangerous. Trust your instincts!

[bobstad]

Bob, don't let him mess with your car again. That moisture in the tail pipe is not fuel, LOL, it's water...and that's good. The mixture is perfect, and the water is a combustion by-product of a proper mixture. Pretty much impossible to have raw fuel puddling in the tailpipe and have the engine still be able to run, let alone run well. Even so, adjusting the idle speed has zero to do with fuel mixture. This is a sign that the Mazda kid knows enough to be dangerous. Trust your instincts!

Hey, just what I was trying to tell myself that night; so glad I held out for my own better judgement. The recognizable scent of cannabis on his breath was another thing, making me more than a little wary; since he was so forward and aggressive with not only free advice, in addition hands on with another's property and responsibility. Also the wild ride in that hopped up Mazda; which is a real rocket sled.

All said, a nice young person however; whose place of employment I rode my old ten-speed to a few nights ago in need of some exercise and to say hello again, who was off work that evening. They seem to like him really well, so perhaps we'll see each other again.

I do have this thing where many people seem to find me easy to overwhelm; so getting to be friends where I don't have to endure that so much, is crucial to my happiness.

I do notice I can do that with others myself; so probably a common facet of the human condition for everyone-either running on like the dam has burst or else so stopped up the constipation feels terminal.

That Mazda sure seems like a work of art, particularly in someone so youthful. I knew lots of gearhead types in Spokane during the early '90s who liked using cannabis; which isn't to say people can't enjoy that reasonably.

But, the tendency to become preoccupied by single focus interests seems fostered by social drug use of any type. Having a well rounded mind with a diversity of interests seems far healthier than the scenes I was at the periphery of in Spokane; where competency at one or a few things allowed dominance, of some pretty stupid people: Who one is made vulnerable too, when drugged oneself. Which those seeking dominance understood, and worked at promoting.

[DriverOne]

Re: Running too rich? Adjust idle faster due to that?

Bobstad, it has been my experience that those under the age of 25 with an incredible machine the likes of which you speak didn't build it themselves, rather they had the disposable income to have it built by a shop, and have read up on automotive media. There are the exceptions, i.e., AdvanceDynamix (I am referring to his aforementioned past), but often the case is the former of the two. I agree, take his "knowledge" with a grain of salt, and research everything he says with which you find interest.

[jtugfestiva]

Now you know what that screw is and knowing is half the battle . Remember check all hoses, clean IAC, throttle bodies, change 02 sensors, changing spark plugs and filters is all you need to a good idle.

[bobstad]

To Driver One; that Mazda was awesome, so I can respect your opinion even though the young fellow worked at a pizza place; which doesn't preclude sufficient disposable income presuming he were still living at home or even sharing an inexpensive residence somehow. To jtugfestiva; I've gotten all the various components you've suggested up to date and well inspected, while blkfordsedan's advice that moisture in the tailpipe is water not fuel; seems to suggest everything in my car is functioning well, too?

The youth had seemed a little too interested in the Festiva at first; as if perhaps scouting my car as one he'd like to acquire, while soon becoming convinced I'm knowledgeable about my car, which I plan on hanging onto. He did have a good concept of the interchangeability between those late '80s Mazda 323s and Festivas; so probably at least his general curiosity, as someone an interested car buff into his speciality.

I've noticed in general as someone myself, with a not too aggressive personality; there are certain types of people who advance themselves, attempting to be overpowering. I got that feeling with this youth at first, though as we became more acquainted he also became far more relaxed and interesting. Had he not the cannabis habit, I would find him a more compelling person to want to try to get to know; while I also think this may not be deeply ingrained, so perhaps we'll see more of each other anyway?

I do think that as heavy a pre-occupation as he has with cars, enough to be driving such a rig as he has; this isn't all that healthy an interest, in someone supporting themselves working at a pizza joint. If he'd been a professional of some sort involved with cars, like a welder or machinist or auto mechanic that would be different; though as a hobbiest that hopped up very powerful Mazda seems far too involving, of someone who could benefit more by a greater diversity of interests.

I've the experiences of too many friends over the years, for whom cars have become an all enveloping realm; which for whatever reasons sustains them as central interests, to the exclusion of far too much, I think of as essential to the growth of a healthy mind. Just the amounts of money involved, is at core of a degradation of many important human values; when resources get devoted in such unbalanced ways. Usually a few other things also end up consuming lots of cash; with expensive stereos, one obvious thing I can think of quickly.

This youth still shows good signs of fundamental worthy personality qualities, so disturbing wondering how this Mazda and related interests can become so overwhelming? While, I also have to factor for the sorts of careers involving automobiles; generating not only interests of this powerful sort but, also the means to sustain those directions. One of the most stridently prominent facets of the culture of this country, since the Model T; in other words. A flood tide, hard to imagine stemming; yet worthwhile trying to think of alternatives.

[lessersivad]

Thats the idle set screw. If you set it a little high your car will run at a higher RPMs thus burning more fuel. This screw doesn't adjust the fuel or air mixture since the car is electronically controlled.

Ummm, I'm not meaning to be nit-picky but...The screw under the cap is called the "IDLE AIR ADJUST SCREW" as per the 1990 Festiva factory service manual I have.

Meaning it allows air to bypass the almost fully closed throttle valve for combustion.

It isn't a "set screw" persay, but in fact an air adjustment screw.

Yes, it IS the only adjustment for idle speed recommended by the shop manual, but it isn't a "set screw".

References from pages 24-05-6 and 24-05-7. 1990 Festiva car shop manual.

[Movin]

All these years I have been looking at a tach while adjusting that that thing,
Now I need to get an air flow meter..

[lessersivad]

All these years I have been looking at a tach while adjusting that that thing,
Now I need to get an air flow meter..

I do appreciate your witty response and many helpful contributions to the forum.

I was simply being a stickler for the correct terminology for the thingamabob under the rubber doohickey that is used for the idle speed adjustment.

[Movin]

thingamabob under the rubber doohickey that is used for the idle speed adjustment.

Now that is the way things are normally described to me !

[bobstad]

Hurricane force & rising; with snow a "Crystal Gale"

All these years I have been looking at a tach while adjusting that that thing,
Now I need to get an air flow meter..

I'm wondering if there could be developed, an accurate "wind-bag" measuring device?

Since over the years, as a woefully inadequate woodwind jazz musician, despite that or perhaps because of the facts; I've managed to accumulate so many virtuoso woodwind musician friends. This is like having a pet orangutang, everyone has to try to comfort as if one more normal member of the crowd of familiars; of whom perhaps my friend Bert Wilson won't mind mention, he is the unchallenged flagship of that curious fleet.

Bert is a "world famous underground jazz legend," born during 1939; once as he has written of himself, "the male Shirley Temple" being raised as a child dancer: Two years into that career when a four year-old, stricken by severe polio; who has needed assistance ever since, even to sit up in bed.

Nicknamed "Wheelz" the intrepid superstar, practices twelve hours a day; who recently played a performance I'll probably forever resent not having been invited to, in Olympia's posh Washington Center for the Performance Arts.[http://issuu.com/the-washington-cent...olor=%23222222

Bert's closest Olympia friends a few years before we met; spent the majority of my collegiate career torturing me psychologically while keeping me stoned constantly on the overwhelmingly prevailing Columbian red or gold cannabis, they use organizing that community of familiars dominating the state capital's arts and music scene. Wilson, who himself has been around a bit, can be comforting alone together; while never wanting to bite the hand which feeds, since he is so dependent as a quadriplegic on that close knit crowd of locals.

Wilson is someone of whom, prominent jazz woodwind musician Tim Price has written; after his death Bert will be rediscovered as were Mozart, Bach & Beethoven, to form the bedrock of some similar future musical pantheon. So, you have to guess at what now lies in their musical vaults; and what all has gone on there, and the various other places Bert has managed to pilot himself and a dedicated entourage-I've hovered uncomfortably on the periphery of, now almost four decades.