Front end blues; apparently made worse by recent ball joint replacement?

[bobstad]

I've driven twice now on the I-5 freeway to nearly Seattle and back, about a hundred and sixty or seventy miles total per trip; and the front end is really sloppy, as if something were made far worse by the recent new passenger side ball joint and half-shaft on that side being both replaced with new parts. Driving around town, there isn't anything apparently amiss. I've sometimes mentioned how much jostling can be apparent on the freeway here; which people say is due to all the heavy truck traffic chewing up the roads-while expressing an attitude those could be done away with, to no one's chagrin.

I have no idea what is going on, though the roads are jouncing the car terribly except for a few short breaks along the way; or otherwise I'd be tempted to suspect a wheel weight was lost or more than one, since otherwise the new parts should've improved things dramatically after limping along with the right/passenger side ball joint continuing to deteriorate a long time. The symptoms don't really suggest loss of wheel weights, though the only variable I can imagine given what has been done recently to the car?

This morning's plan was to drive to another local shop to get an unbiased opinion; since the potential of suspicions makes me feel this is prudent, not to mention a good vibe I've had off the place in mind some time ago must be admitted. I was thinking the day after Xmas there'd be few other customers too, or even the hope of some residual charitable, seasonal feelings in combination with the other.

I don't like the idea of having to be circumspect with the shop which did the work on replacement of the ball joint and half-shaft, since they'd been likable, convenient and certainly efficient; though probably no harm done in getting a second opinion, is the way I'm thinking. Since there is such an obvious deterioration from what I'd felt prior to the replacement parts, given that the worn ball joint was making some definite notice of that being on the way out; this sure has me stumped and also wary, imagining any sort of thing impossible to comprehend from what I'm apprised of now.

What I'm thinking of doing is simply sitting on the pavement next to either of the wheels, to grab the top of the tire and rock back and forth testing the slack or lack of same; which is always one of the tests given a car's front end, I know of. Perhaps there are a few others, worth doing at the same time? I don't feel safe driving with the car this way, is one gauge of how badly things have changed; when having to wonder what could be the solution, without having any clue and on top of the recent work I'd felt confident would leave the car in perfect shape again. Always an encouraging feel until this ball joint began to go bad, particularly on the freeway in a straight line; which tracks like I'm on a beam, even when over 85 mph hydro-planing in heavy rain...normally.

[TheresGabe]

What this sounds like to me...

You said they replaced the ball joints, therefore implying that they actually replaced the entire lower control arm correct? The new lower control arm that you got, should have come with new bushings for the sway bar. They are kind of a pain to get on there, so it's possible that they went and used the old bushings, or possibly your new LCA didn't have the new bushings? Also, did they remember to put the cotter pins back in, on the end of the sway bar, after tightening?

I ask these questions, because I have had similar situation lately, based on my poor work done on my LCA's. First I had the issue where when I hit the gas the car were swerve wild to the left, and sure enough when I let off the gas, it swerved wildly right. Turned out that re-using the old cotter pin was a bad idea, as it had broken, and the nut was almost completely backed off on the passenger side sway bar. Currently I am suffering from having re-used the bushing for the sway bar, where it goes through the lower control arm. The new ones were a BEAST to get on, and then I couldn't even get the nut started, so I just used the old ones. There is a clunk on the passenger side, and it's pretty squishy in the corners.

Hopefully this helps?

[bobstad]

battered woman; good with mushrooms, pepper and salt.

What this sounds like to me...

You said they replaced the ball joints, therefore implying that they actually replaced the entire lower control arm correct? The new lower control arm that you got, should have come with new bushings for the sway bar. They are kind of a pain to get on there, so it's possible that they went and used the old bushings, or possibly your new LCA didn't have the new bushings? Also, did they remember to put the cotter pins back in, on the end of the sway bar, after tightening?

I ask these questions, because I have had similar situation lately, based on my poor work done on my LCA's. First I had the issue where when I hit the gas the car were swerve wild to the left, and sure enough when I let off the gas, it swerved wildly right. Turned out that re-using the old cotter pin was a bad idea, as it had broken, and the nut was almost completely backed off on the passenger side sway bar. Currently I am suffering from having re-used the bushing for the sway bar, where it goes through the lower control arm. The new ones were a BEAST to get on, and then I couldn't even get the nut started, so I just used the old ones. There is a clunk on the passenger side, and it's pretty squishy in the corners.

Hopefully this helps?

Good advice; which makes me feel better about returning to the place doing the work, than seeking first elsewhere. I have already added new rubber bushings to the front anti-sway bar; so a disappointment if they've spaced those both out. The price was right, so the idea they may've reused the cotter pins seems just barely feasible; with the tiny savings that would've made? At least I'll be able to comment intelligently, in ways which if accurate could allow a seemly resolution. Otherwise, given the nature of the lapses if this advice is worthwhile; you wonder if these folks would be intelligent enough to catch their own errors? Wow, that is some bad! I'd guess they must've been tripping; unless done on purpose for some reason? There was a funky looking woman on the sidewalk as I was leaving the parking lot after the two hour job I'd waited there for; who'd given an aura of some sort of censure, cynically enough.

[bobstad]

Plenty of mustard around here; too.

[bobstad]

Nothing quite like a looker; lashed to the roof.

There was a funky looking woman on the sidewalk as I was leaving the parking lot after the two hour job I'd waited there for; who'd given an aura of some sort of censure, cynically enough.

The shop is on the corner of the block the local food bank is on, also adjacent to the place. I've often stood in line, leaning on one of their used cars for sale in the small lot they have in front of the building their office and shop are both part of; or sitting on the fender of one of their front-liners. With only one line, that makes everything they sell, a front-liner.

They also sport a blue LeCar the same color as my Festiva; oddly enough. The wiper blades are far too large for the car; so droop off the windshield like a woman wearing ridiculously long false eyelashes.

[DriverOne]

Re: Front end blues; apparently made worse by recent ball joint replacement?

I have found that by reusing the rear-fitted bushing in part of the installation, it makes things immensely easier. Install the front bushings, and use the weaker, older bushings as a means of drawing the new bushing into the LCA by installing them to the rear. Torque on them as if you were finished, and wait about five minutes or so. Remove the nut and washer, and install the new rear bushings. They won't give you nearly as much trouble. I also suggest a drop of blue loc-tite as extra resistance so as not to rely on the cotter pins so much.

[bobstad]

Brassie Cacophoni

I've just awoken to a dream, which turning on the television found the protagonist of that Night Gallery episode looking like the Tony Gatlif of my dream about attending a theatrical production of Gatlif's film Latcho Drom who'd been sort of seedier a little in the dream. In the Night Gallery episode, the man is a dj at station KAPH; being abused somehow as have been a series of others apparently.... The dream ends with everyone packing up from the large convention hall place in Seattle the dream was held at as a macrobiotic vendors three day weekend production was well into getting set up by the time we were all out the door; where while I was putting everything I had out and spread around from my car, the '66 VW "square-back" sedan, back inside; some characters looking pretty homogenous to the scene who I think may've been AfAms, one or two people, sold me some cannabis in a baggie after pleading a little to get me to loosen up some funds. I'd told them I could at the best spare $50-$100 and wasn't sure in the dream how much of that got exchanged; though pawing through my things a little later wasn't able to come immediately to hand with my purchase: Not that the stuff wasn't aboard so to speak; however. This was finally as I was snooping through my things, when everyone else was pulling out; so I found myself following the Tony Gatlif character of the dream out onto the sidewalk then down that and around a street corner, outside the hall the production of his theatrical Latcho Drom was made in; where we all sort of disappeared into a cacophony of the folks inside for his thing, as I was still trying to find & pin him down to get to know the guy a little better or whatever-since the event had made such a fine impression on me. This following may relate, is one thought of the moment; which I'm planning on trying to attend January 25th nearby here in Vancouver, BC.[http://www.orkestarslivovica.org/eve...rass-menazeri/ I've heard Peter Jaques' band Brass Menazeri a few times, even once sleeping together in someone's stored RV he had to remove a tarp covering that from to allow us inside at the ranch like orchard or vineyard near Graton, CA during one of the Voice of Roma California Herdeljezi festivals probably the one in '04; which is a group officially disbanding a few days following this performance, as Jacques has gotten a Fulbright scholarship or grant of some sort to study music in the Balkans. Latcho Drom, by the way means "safe journey" so probably I'm okay driving the FestivaL Car as is; though ought to get around to working on the front end a little, for the sake of the tires and whatever else may be involved. I'm glad I snagged a pair of like new rubber front sway bar grommets off an Aspire recently; in case those aren't reinstalled which were a pair bought new not too long ago, since I've had the car-for sure. Now, back to Mission Impossible; on KVOS-12...

[bobstad]

Digressing more than a little; opps!

I've just awoken to a dream, which turning on the television found the protagonist of that Night Gallery episode looking like the Tony Gatlif of my dream about attending a theatrical production of Gatlif's film Latcho Drom who'd been sort of seedier a little in the dream. In the Night Gallery episode, the man is a dj at station KAPH; being abused somehow as have been a series of others apparently.... The dream ends with everyone packing up from the large convention hall place in Seattle the dream was held at as a macrobiotic vendors three day weekend production was well into getting set up by the time we were all out the door; where while I was putting everything I had out and spread around from my car, the '66 VW "square-back" sedan, back inside; some characters looking pretty homogenous to the scene who I think may've been AfAms, one or two people, sold me some cannabis in a baggie after pleading a little to get me to loosen up some funds. I'd told them I could at the best spare $50-$100 and wasn't sure in the dream how much of that got exchanged; though pawing through my things a little later wasn't able to come immediately to hand with my purchase: Not that the stuff wasn't aboard so to speak; however. This was finally as I was snooping through my things, when everyone else was pulling out; so I found myself following the Tony Gatlif character of the dream out onto the sidewalk then down that and around a street corner, outside the hall the production of his theatrical Latcho Drom was made in; where we all sort of disappeared into a cacophony of the folks inside for his thing, as I was still trying to find & pin him down to get to know the guy a little better or whatever-since the event had made such a fine impression on me. This following may relate, is one thought of the moment; which I'm planning on trying to attend January 25th nearby here in Vancouver, BC.[http://www.orkestarslivovica.org/eve...rass-menazeri/ I've heard Peter Jaques' band Brass Menazeri a few times, even once sleeping together in someone's stored RV he had to remove a tarp covering that from to allow us inside at the ranch like orchard or vineyard near Graton, CA during one of the Voice of Roma California Herdeljezi festivals probably the one in '04; which is a group officially disbanding a few days following this performance, as Jacques has gotten a Fulbright scholarship or grant of some sort to study music in the Balkans. Latcho Drom, by the way means "safe journey" so probably I'm okay driving the FestivaL Car as is; though ought to get around to working on the front end a little, for the sake of the tires and whatever else may be involved. I'm glad I snagged a pair of like new rubber front sway bar grommets off an Aspire recently; in case those aren't reinstalled which were a pair bought new not too long ago, since I've had the car-for sure. Now, back to Mission Impossible; on KVOS-12...

Phew, way off topic! Sorry about that folks; especially to myself.

I've not gotten around to doing anything about this with the car yet; particularly since suffering a mini-bender cum hangover aftermath, from the New Year's fifth of on-sale Canadian whiskey, then a lot of rain here since then...

I try to limit myself to the occasional half-pint or more usually those "hotel mini-bar/mile high club" .050 liter bottles, so getting tempted on New Year's eve day or the day before by a fifth was a significant attitude adjustment to have to battle back against. I'm philosophically a teetotaler adrift amidst the world's manifest temptations; sampling of those for better understanding.

[denguy]

Could you be more specific about what the car is doing and when, and what are you doing?

[bobstad]

Sorry; I'm an idiot at times-getting off-topic in this forum for self-help repair.

I've driven to Seattle and back a few more times since starting this thread: Convincing me a great deal of the problem is the freeway surface being pounded by lots and lots of heavy truck traffic. While I may want to make sure that all the wheel weights are still intact-from a balancing job when the tires were new over ten thousand miles ago I'm pretty sure?

There seems to be something a little strange; yet more subtle than I'd first felt was the case? I'm planning on a return to the same shop which did the new ball-joint/control arm & replaced the drive-shaft on the same side: To get them to put fresh brake fluid in the system I've not done myself in far too long.

So; with a better attitude while also giving them some more business-this should be a good time to have their opinions on their own work.

I perhaps get way too paranoiac; particularly concerning cars.

When fifteen years old the summer of 1967 I worked the first half the summer for world famous hobo journalist John Patric; whose 1939 book also serialized in Readers Digest-called The Repairman May Gyp You: Is all about his and two helpers experiences taking a car and various appliances and other items to repair shops-finding over sixty percent of the time they were taken advantage of; dishonestly as well as illegally-of course.

Besides a two year-old Lincoln Zepher; they'd had a typewriter, table radio, pocket watch and I forget what else-they were expert at making seem as if something was wrong; very simple to fix. My experiences as someone low-income living on government assistance; is finding the incredible and incredibly stylized manner of rationalizations people use stealing from me: As I try to do both commerce-as well as deal with government oriented programs. Total capitalistic brainwashing; by the dominant sectors of society.

Once again off-topic here a little; though perhaps not too much to obscure where I'm currently at with the issue. I'll report back with more news as that develops.

[WmWatt]

You can try rotating the tires to see if that makes any difference.
You can check that all the nuts and bolts are tight. One might have been overlooked.

[navdoc101]

Take your Meds & try to stay ON topic. Have them check the bushings on your cars front end. I remember back in 1967...oh, hever mind.

[bobstad]

Take your Meds & try to stay ON topic. Have them check the bushings on your cars front end. I remember back in 1967...oh, hever mind.

Wow; never get me started on the subject of psychiatric medication-which I avoid like the plague with good reason: Though here is an excellent resource if anyone is interested; medical journalist Robert Whitaker I heard speak as one of three keynote speakers to the May 17th, 2003 conference of psychiatric survivors at the Everett Middle School in Frisco's Mission District-where I was one of only a few people not at least at one time addicted to those horrific and nearly impossible to quit drugs and/or victimized as well by electro-shock therapy.[http://robertwhitaker.org/robertwhitaker.org/Home.html

Worth noting is that only in this country has the use of psychiatric medications been allowed to become the huge social problem those create; typically worsening the condition of anyone using them as if a chronic condition. The brain is the body's most naturally protected organ; whose chemistry is the very last thing to go awry under any conditions: While the upper echelons of medical hierarchy have been exposed as colluding with the huge transnational corporations in promoting the highly profitable psychiatric medications; by falsifying much about those drugs.

Some virtuous use of psychiatric medications in very limited applications has been pioneered in Finland; as acute medication for short periods of time-integrated with other therapies. Mental dysfunction is largely a social problem; while my difficulties are primarily from early life & juvenile spinal diseases-compounded by an active and cynical intelligence: Without the necessary competence to successfully rob banks-I guess?