Car trouble :(

[anthony1707]

Alright guys so I have been having trouble with my festiva project lately. The car sometimes does not want to start, but after a few tries it will run and idle but initially if you give the car gas it will actually cause the car to die. Removing the green engine temperature sensor on the fuel rail seems to help this.After going through that for awhile it will then hold an idle, and will respond very well to the throttle and will idle nicely. ( i have already adjusted the t.p.s to the factory specification using continuity between the three pins.) The issue is that when i go to drive the car, it will not die but it will bog down terrible and will not really drive at all. It can move itself but its miserable- no power, does not truly respond to what i am doing with the throttle. Fuel pump, filter, and 1 dead injector have all been replaced. I have checked the intake system from the air box to the throttle body, and there are no air leaks (tested with compressed air). I also have double checked the timing belt and the marks are aligned. Compression test has revealed uneven/low numbers. 1-124, 2-123, 3-90, 4- 80. Is this my problem off the bat? I am ashamed to admit this but after doing the head gasket, clutch, timing belt etc... i ran the car without the alternator belt because i had lost it and had though no big deal i will just charge the battery. I know now that it drives the water pump. I wont make it sound better than it is i ran the car at idle for 25 minutes like this and the coolant did bubble over in the expansion tank. The radiator fan also does not work so i just have it hardwired to the battery to make it run, could be a part of the problem idle problem? I thought then maybe that my problem was a warped head so i did a cylinder leak down test on all four cylinders. my gauge was acting up and was not giving me a reading for leak down percentage but i was able to send the air through the cylinder and hear the air coming out. cylinder 1 held air well. 2 did as well. they both held 100 p.s.i without trouble. 3 and 4 however did the same thing and just shot tons of air out through the oil fill cap, oil dipstick hole, and the pcv hole. that tells me air is getting past the piston via rings .....hmmm. The other thing is that my oil and coolant both look great, the levels of both has stayed consistent, and are not mixed. during the leakdown there was no bubbles in the coolant. the valves sealed well during all the cylinder's test. i used a stethoscope to listen to the air and none was coming from exhaust/ intake valves. I leave for the air force october 16th and i am trying to figure out whats best to do. is my engine toast? Am i just missing something obvious? is there hope? I know this is a long one so i appreciate any feedback at all, thank you!

[Stanza]

90 and 80 are tragic low. That's most of your problem, you are essentially running on 2 out of four cylinders. Could be that the rings are shot/stuck, or it could be a bad valve seal. Could also be a head gasket leak.

[WmWatt]

I'd try a wet and dry compression test to see how much effect the rings are having.
Did the temperature guage in the dash not warn you the car was running hot without the water pump running?
Low compressioin in two adjacent cyclinders can indicate a leak in the head gasket between the two.

[ryanprins13]

The B3 can handle a lot of heat, but 25min with no water pump and not moving was probably too much.
Did it run well/drive without bogging after the timing belt change? Or did this all happen when bleeding the coolant after the belt change?

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[anthony1707]

I was not able to get it driving well after the timing belt change, and the overheat just added to the problem. The car's temperature gauge is aftermarket and i had though it was working because it was getting power (led back lighting) but it was stuck at one position. There is a new gauge in there now but i didn't give it enough thought prior to the overheat. I was thinking it was head gasket as well but i don't understand why the leak down test did not produce bubbles in the coolant, and why the air was coming from the crankcase points. I will try a wet and dry test to see the difference, thank you.

[ryanprins13]

Stupid question probably but if your valve timing is off one tooth will that cause low numbers on a compresaion test because the valves open at the wrong time? I know the car bogs bad when valve timing is off because ive done it. Its super easy to be a tooth or 2 off and you wouldnt be the first person to double check and miss that it was off if it is the problem. But air leaking into the crankcase does sound like rings...

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[bravekozak]

Stupid question probably but if your valve timing is off one tooth will that cause low numbers on a compresaion test because the valves open at the wrong time?

The valves will still open and close late or early, The compression test is for the highest reading. So no.

[anthony1707]

So it could not be a timing problem? I did check the belt and ignition timing and they look good, but if the timing cannot effect compression than that must mean i have a problem with rings/head causing the engine to run poorly?

[ryanprins13]

The valves will still open and close late or early, The compression test is for the highest reading. So no.

Ok!

So it could not be a timing problem? I did check the belt and ignition timing and they look good, but if the timing cannot effect compression than that must mean i have a problem with rings/head causing the engine to run poorly?

Yeah, a festiva will run no problem on 100psi all across but uneven compression like that is bad. I dont know how that would relate to it bogging down though. Sorry im not much help with this :/

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[w4rkry]

Have you tested fuel pressure?
I have seen quite a few new fuel pumps fail right out of the box .

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[anthony1707]

No need to apologize ryanprins, thank you very much for your time and help. I have not tested fuel pressure. Would a faulty pump allow the engine to rev at idle but bog under load? It would just not be able to send the amount of fuel required under load?

[w4rkry]

No need to apologize ryanprins, thank you very much for your time and help. I have not tested fuel pressure. Would a faulty pump allow the engine to rev at idle but bog under load? It would just not be able to send the amount of fuel required under load?

Yup, exactly that. I had a pump that would fluctuate between 5 and 20 PSI, And it needs to be 35-40 constant. As soon as you hit the pedal, it would bog and die.

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[Rick the Quick]

You have bad rings on #3 + 4. The car may drive ok with low compression but keep in mind the B3 was rated at around 65 hp and to produce 65 hp you need an engine with good compression on all 4 cylinders. I would imagine your engine is probably putting out a little bit more than half of what it did when new or healthy regardless of miles. How good would you expect it to run with 40 hp? Mr Will is right when he mentions checking fuel pressure. Other things that come to mind are ignition timing and a clogged converter. These engines use a vibration dampner that consists of an inner hub and an outer ring with rubber in between them. The outer rings have been known to slip causing the timing mark on the outer ring to be in the retarded position. There are good videos on You Tube that show how to verify if the marks are accurate. It involves finding positive TDC. An easy test is to loosen your distributor hold down and rotate the distributor a few degrees. You want to advance your timing a bit and go for a quick test ride and note any positive changes. if it runs better your timing marks that you used to time it may be off a bit due to the outer ring moving on the hub. You can also unbolt the down pipe from the converter and go for a ride and see if it makes any difference. I once bought a Honda Civic very cheaply because it ran so poorly. In my mind the camshaft timing was off a couple of teeth. After checking I found the cam and crank were perfectly timed. A vacuum gauge showed close to zero at idle. Your idle vacuum should be around 21 inches on a V8, a bit less on a 4 cylinder. I thought for a minute, what could cause zero vacuum at idle......a clogged converter. What goes in must come out or there is no more coming in. I disconnected the converter and drove it home. It ran perfectly. One more thing that can drive you crazy is a bad ignition coil or a weak ignition. I have had cars with a bad coil idle fine and rev just fine in neutral. Put them in drive and they would barely run. As for running without the water pump you probably did not hurt it. Your engine does not produce a lot of heat at idle and I believe if you did any damage you would know it....Good luck.

[anthony1707]

okay so this is where I am. I tested for fuel pressure and and it was fluctuating which was a bit annoying considering its a new pump but hey like Will said, new ones fail, so I will replace the pump and address the issue. I have also thought about what rick and others said and I realized that even getting this engine to run as well as it can, it will still end up with a sub par engine if i am running with uneven and bad compression with bad piston rings. While contemplating what to do I found a 5-speed transmission at a junkyard (mine currently grinds 2nd gear- tried different oil, has new clutch etc), so yesterday a friend and I pulled it from a 93 blue festiva. It now makes sense to me to pull the engine and tranny as a unit out of my festiva and to just tear into the b3 and figure out what is going on in there . My hope is that the head is not warped, and that the block does not need to be bored. It was supposedly rebuilt at one other time, so I will only know what is going on when i get in there and get some measurements. Thank you to everybody who gave advice, it just makes sense at this point to recondition the b3 (hone, piston rings, bearings etc...)since I am pulling it to put a new tranny in anyway.

[w4rkry]

okay so this is where I am. I tested for fuel pressure and and it was fluctuating which was a bit annoying considering its a new pump but hey like Will said, new ones fail, so I will replace the pump and address the issue. I have also thought about what rick and others said and I realized that even getting this engine to run as well as it can, it will still end up with a sub par engine if i am running with uneven and bad compression with bad piston rings. While contemplating what to do I found a 5-speed transmission at a junkyard (mine currently grinds 2nd gear- tried different oil, has new clutch etc), so yesterday a friend and I pulled it from a 93 blue festiva. It now makes sense to me to pull the engine and tranny as a unit out of my festiva and to just tear into the b3 and figure out what is going on in there . My hope is that the head is not warped, and that the block does not need to be bored. It was supposedly rebuilt at one other time, so I will only know what is going on when i get in there and get some measurements. Thank you to everybody who gave advice, it just makes sense at this point to recondition the b3 (hone, piston rings, bearings etc...)since I am pulling it to put a new tranny in anyway.

If you are going that far, I would look into engine swaps. I wouldn't spend too much time rebuilding a B3 personally, they are not worth much. It's cheaper in my area to just pop them an replace as a unit than it is to refresh! Lol

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