torsional damper?

[FestYboy]

does anyone make one for the B series? I'm thinking i want to add one to my festy. it's never a bad thing to have.

[mechanicaldj]

unless your festy is internally balanced

[FestYboy]

huh? :?

[JerseyJay1.8T]

you're talking about the hydraulic-charged strut that goes from engine to frame right? Measure it out, but one in a size thats close, and fab a bracket or two.

[FestYboy]

nope, talking about what people usually call a harmonic balancer.

[mechanicaldj]

nope, talking about what people usually call a harmonic balancer.

harmonic balancer are usually for externally balanced engines, which the balancer is weighted

[FestYboy]

i realize that, that's why i referred to it as a torsional damper and not balancer. i know that the BP and other B series motors had them from the factory and that it's a good thing to have on any engine regardless of how it's balanced, so i want one for my festy.

i ask again, where can i find one???

[Silv3rBull3t]

How many Festiva owners/enthusiasts have there been that have either driven their cars for hundreds of thousands of miles or beaten on them and have had no problems... Why would we need one? It just seems like a waste of time and effort.. There are alot of weak points in a Festy but I don't think that's one of them.. -Kyle

[Safety Guy]

I'm with Kyle. My B6 runs smooth enough for me. Any additional balancing would probably just add weight. Rotating weight!

Don't need that.

Karl

[mechanicaldj]

i am a part of a pit crew

who races a 1987 190E 2.3 16V.

on our HOT motor we reduced rotating weight were we could to the limit.

on the flywheel, we had it custom machined down from about 30 lbs to about 15 lbs.

and we installed lighter pistons and connecting rods, and had the crankshaft re-balanced.

we now have a much higher revving engine that produces about 200hp @ 7000 rpm.

and of course we re-ground the camshafts and other mods too.

maybe one day i might do the same to my festy, if i decide to go road racing in it.

[FestYboy]

you see, for me it's not about the rotating weight (i have a 10.5 lb flywheel) it's about keeping the crank alive by reducing 3rd, 4th, and 5th order harmonics that are being produced by the rotating parts of the engine. it's been proven that a torsional damper can improve smoothness and power by keeping the engine from seeing detrimental reversions of crank rotation while running.

if dampers weren't so important, then why do you see them on any race track you go to?? you know those engines are prepped and balanced better than anything coming out of the factory and yet they still use a damper. so, how can this be a bad thing for our cars? the added rotating weight is insignificant anyway because of how close it's positioned to the center-line of the crank. we'd never know the difference, but I'd almost guarantee you'd feel an improvement in idle quality and smoothness.

[mechanicaldj]

i will humor you for a bit,

if you do put one on,
where in the world are you going to put your pulleys??
and what about the vehicle frame? isn't it a little bit in the way?

and gee wiz, the Festiva AINT a Cadillac!!!!!

[FestYboy]

i will humor you for a bit,

if you do put one on,
where in the world are you going to put your pulleys??
and what about the vehicle frame? isn't it a little bit in the way?

and gee wiz, the Festiva AINT a Cadillac!!!!!

well I've been searching Mazda323performance.com and have discovered that there were/are crank pulleys with torsional dampers attached. and according to them, they were stock on certain cars that had the B Series engines. most on the forum agree that removing one for the sake of rotating weight is a BAD THING. so at this point I'm assuming that it's possible there's one that would fit our applications. it'll probably be easier for me seeing that i have no accessories other than ALT and water pump. the frame shouldn't be any problem for me, I've got about 2" of room left, and there's room between the pulley and block as well.

as for the Cadillac bit, I'd be happy if mine idled like it did when it was stock again. the low RPM vibrations are starting to annoy/worry me.

also I've been on a quest to eliminate this ticking sound from my engine. it' sounds like a bad lifter but I've changed out those and it hasn't gone away. it's been there since the engine was new, and i can only suspect the fuel pump now. but I'm not sure why this would cause it unless the return spring on the arm is bad, it doesn't feel bad to me.

[Silv3rBull3t]

If it was a problem then don't you think Ford/Mazda/Kia would've done something about it a long time ago????? Why do you think engineers said it was ok? How come these engines (w/o) a harmonic balancer have lasted hundreds of thousands of miles??? You haven't answered this... Until you can prove to me there is a REASON that our engines need one, I still say it's a worthless addition of rotating weight. I understand your point if you plan on revving your engine to 6000RPM for 30 minute intervals 6 times a weekend road racing but otherwise I don't see it being necessary at all.. Also, I know alot of friends that have been road racing for years and haven't "added" any "performance" harmonic balancers to their engines... -Kyle

[JerseyJay1.8T]

kyle, don't bother, FestyBoy has already demonstrated that he doesn't care about actually proving that something works, hearsay and conjecture is more than enough proof for him..... :roll:

Thats why i thought by torsional damper that he meant one of those torque brace things... cuz i've never heard of someone adding a harmonic balancer to an engine that didn't come with one. Funny that he argues how aspire rockers are a must do mod because his butt dyno says 2-3 hp gain, but now he wants to add 5 lbs to the crank and take it away again....