torsional damper?

[FestYboy]

see, now you guys are just being dicks :x all i asked is where i could find one and you jump all over my case about how it's "not going to add performance" and "if it wasn't there from the factory, why add it now". Add that to the fact that i can't just jump down to the local dyno any time i want and prove/disprove any mods I've done, so i have to base any improvements on what i feel and can measure with a stopwatch and speedometer. But you can't believe those statements because they're not quantitative or "scientific" analysis of what happened.

well what about muffler mods that others have done???? they didn't have use of a dyno, but you believed them. and the CAI mods that you do???? no "proof" there either. and then there's the gripe about the Festy exhaust manifold vs. the aspire one, and which one flows better? well it's the Festy manifold that wins that one if for only one reason, IT'S CAST IRON!!!! and as we all know, cast iron parts tend to retain heat better than those made of tube steel due to the added mass. heat retention = faster gas velocity =more CFM. Oh and to add to that, the ports are larger on the cast unit as well as the collector being radiused toward the flange and not having the tubes face each other as in the Aspire unit.

you guys are a bunch of jackholes :evil: unsupportive in any way and i hope all of your cranks break at the snout just to piss you off.

*UCKERS

[PaulLehr]

Well I think what the people here were getting at is that since the motor is internally balanced you don't need one. Adding one will do nothing for you. unless you have internal engine problems or a slightly bent crank. If you really want one then just take a look at the other Mazda B series motors and see if you can come up with something that would sute your needs. Perhaps the crank pulley from a BP motor with the outer belt grove machined down? I don't know if the crank ends are the same though

[JerseyJay1.8T]

I'm not trying to be a jerk man, and i don't believe anyone who says a muffler or intake gave them a noticeable gain either. I don't expect you to run to a dyno every time you do a mod, but i think its perfectly reasonable to ask you not to MAKE A POST saying how great a mod works and how much difference it makes, when in reality you have no proof of it.... Because frankly, some people are sheep and will simply go out and duplicate what you've done because you say so, and no, that's not your fault, but you should try to avoid making unvalidated statements because they don't help anyone. That's all i'm saying. If you want to discuss it further, PM me so that this doesn't turn into a soap opera.

[jeffdjeffd]

Debate about validity is okay. Disagreement is okay. Personal attacks go to the arena or email. No more warnings in this topic for you three. No problems, just keep it civil, and keep it about Festivas (and related).
thanks guys!
jeff

PS - I've found the discussion pretty interesting. I've seen Corvairs run without the HB, and it can get ugly. Of course, I also tend to put some trust in people's experiences with mods on Festivas over empirical data, just because that empirical data costs $$, and most of us don't have that to spend on a Festy. Nothing wrong with a cheap mod you can take off if it doesn't work. Hell, if I ruin the engine, I can get a new car for less than a dyno run :shock:

[B6T]

see, now you guys are just being dicks :x all i asked is where i could find one and you jump all over my case about how it's "not going to add performance" and "if it wasn't there from the factory, why add it now". Add that to the fact that i can't just jump down to the local dyno any time i want and prove/disprove any mods I've done, so i have to base any improvements on what i feel and can measure with a stopwatch and speedometer. But you can't believe those statements because they're not quantitative or "scientific" analysis of what happened.

well what about muffler mods that others have done???? they didn't have use of a dyno, but you believed them. and the CAI mods that you do???? no "proof" there either. and then there's the gripe about the Festy exhaust manifold vs. the aspire one, and which one flows better? well it's the Festy manifold that wins that one if for only one reason, IT'S CAST IRON!!!! and as we all know, cast iron parts tend to retain heat better than those made of tube steel due to the added mass. heat retention = faster gas velocity =more CFM. Oh and to add to that, the ports are larger on the cast unit as well as the collector being radiused toward the flange and not having the tubes face each other as in the Aspire unit.

you guys are a bunch of jackholes :evil: unsupportive in any way and i hope all of your cranks break at the snout just to piss you off.

*UCKERS

Use a B6T crank pulley you whiney bitch. It has a rubber damper in it.

And you'd want a header/exhaust manifold to dissipate heat as fast as possible with a normally aspirated engine. That way there would be less gas volume to stuff through the tiny ass exhaust, while keeping velocity up to promote scavenging. The opposite is true with turbocharging because you want as much exhaust gas volume as possible because that's what's spinning that turbine. Don't be surprised if I'm wrong though, because I know nothing about those POS Mazda SOHC 8V 4 cylinders that everyone usually throws in the garbage when they swap in a real engine, one with a turbo and without a carb. :twisted:

[FestYboy]

Debate about validity is okay. Disagreement is okay. Personal attacks go to the arena or email. No more warnings in this topic for you three. No problems, just keep it civil, and keep it about Festivas (and related).
thanks guys!
jeff

PS - I've found the discussion pretty interesting. I've seen Corvairs run without the HB, and it can get ugly. Of course, I also tend to put some trust in people's experiences with mods on Festivas over empirical data, just because that empirical data costs $$, and most of us don't have that to spend on a Festy. Nothing wrong with a cheap mod you can take off if it doesn't work. Hell, if I ruin the engine, I can get a new car for less than a dyno run :shock:

thanks for stepping in and putting us all in our places, it was starting to get out of hand (and i wasn't helping matters) ops: . the whole point of this thread was to see if the HB has any affect on NVH as my B6 at the moment exhibits some excessive vibration at idle. if it works, good, if not then... well whatever :roll: The aspire rocker mod worked for me and i "felt" a gain and for me, that's all that matters. i just thought I'd pass on the idea, though after inspection, i wouldn't recommend this mod applied to an engine with heavy duty valve springs. I'm fairly sure that this led to the destruction of the cam lobes.

Use a B6T crank pulley you whiney bitch.

and i thought you were beyond calling people names :wink:

And you'd want a header/exhaust manifold to dissipate heat as fast as possible with a normally aspirated engine. That way there would be less gas volume to stuff through the tiny ass exhaust, while keeping velocity up to promote scavenging.

don't confuse volume with density, if you cool the exhaust, it becomes more dense and harder to move within a given volume (at least according to my physics books) by keeping things hot, you reduce density by volume, this enables the gas to move faster within a given volume. Also, what about header wrap??? it keeps heat in the headers to promote gas velocity.

The opposite is true with turbocharging because you want as much exhaust gas volume as possible because that's what's spinning that turbine.

and here i thought it was the mass of the exhaust gas at speed pushing against the turbine that caused it to spin. so velocity is what you want, and to increase velocity, you try to retain as much heat as possible hence the turbine wraps and header wrap that's found on many turbocharged race engines.

just my interpretation of your statements and observations at the race track.[/quote]

[packrat427]

Ceramic coat it , Jet Hot , better than wrap,dissipates heat better thats why alot of race cars have coated headers
Header wrap does hold the heat in yes, but it's main purpose it to keep the underhood temp down. and to keep other componets from burning up.

[B6T]

Use a B6T crank pulley you whiney bitch.

and i thought you were beyond calling people names :wink:

You thought wrong!!!

]
don't confuse volume with density, if you cool the exhaust, it becomes more dense and harder to move within a given volume (at least according to my physics books) by keeping things hot, you reduce density by volume, this enables the gas to move faster within a given volume. Also, what about header wrap??? it keeps heat in the headers to promote gas velocity.

and here i thought it was the mass of the exhaust gas at speed pushing against the turbine that caused it to spin. so velocity is what you want, and to increase velocity, you try to retain as much heat as possible hence the turbine wraps and header wrap that's found on many turbocharged race engines.

just my interpretation of your statements and observations at the race track.

See! I told you I was wrong. That's very useful information... thanks for sharing that.

I have a B6T crank pulley in the garage... I can't sell it but I can take some measurements for you. Chances are it will bolt right up though.

[EVOGUN]

Strange, all my exhaust is ceramic coated. The only reason to do it, I found was it looks pretty!

Thanks :wink:

[FestYboy]

thank you very much, the measurement I'm most concerned about is the flange to V depth (if that makes sense) when i measured the festy's (while still on the engine) the total depth looked like 1" from flange to outer edge.

[B6T]

I'm sure it's the same. It's one of those things that have minor little differences but still keep the same major dimensions.

You know how to use Catia, Solid Edge, Etc? I could model it for you if you really needed dimensions that bad.

[mechanicaldj]

*edit*
nope