DAE Max MPG CAMSHAFT

[TominMO]

POOP!!! How did I miss this?!? What do I need to do to get on the cam bandwagon? I've got an auto and a 5-spd I'd like to stick a cam into each. The auto doesn't typically see any speeds over 45-50mph. The 5-spd is usually 55-60mph max.

Before you send in any money, wait until you see positive results from sketchman and me, and others.

[Larry Hampton]

It'll be a bit before I'm ready for this anyway, but I'd heard he was slowing down on his Festy projects to concentrate on stuff that made money which I totally understand.

[bhearts]

So....Matt says this cam is profiled like a turbo cam. Which I'm assuming means less overlap. Isn't the point of the header to increase scavenging and pull extra fresh air in during the overlap phase. So without overlap you can't really take advantage of scavenging.

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[1chrisapple]

Before you send in any money, wait until you see positive results from sketchman and me, and others.

I personally know of one person that had a loss in mpg with the dae cam but power stayd about the same.im not mentioning names on here bc i dont want anything started just meerly letting u guys know.

[rmoltis]

I haven't even heard of anyone getting their dae max mpg cam properly dialed in yet.
With ignition timing or fuel pressure.

Id like to hear from someone who installed and tuned these items on the dyno for peak efficiency.
Then driven for a few hundred miles to comment on what the results are.
These are bold claims without presentable evidence.
Other than opinions and he said she said.

[TominMO]

Hope to go on a run tmw. Drove the Aspire on the hwy today for about 30 miles and did not get a CEL, so all systems go!

[1chrisapple]

sure didn't know u needed a dyno run and all that bs to get th best mpg from the cam.if that's the case its hardly worth it.

[zoe60]

sure didn't know u needed a dyno run and all that bs to get th best mpg from the cam.if that's the case its hardly worth it.

I agree, all a person should have to do is put it in, set their timing, drive around a lot, and check their MPG! Then if yur mileage goes down to say, 29, call Matt and ask him about it. There's a chance he could have made one for mechanical lifters instead of HLA's by mistake though. I will ask him.

[rmoltis]

You don't "need" anything.
If you have something dialed in to you're preference that's all good and dandy.

But usually if you want peak efficiency out of your engine after any mod.
You'll need a tune which is accomplished most accurately on the dyno.

Some people pass on this idea.
And just bolt things on and drive however it runs after.

And some attempt to adjust at home to their preference.

I'm just saying if people are going to slander someone's
quality of work, or name.

They should first make sure they installed/adjusted everything correctly.
And have facts and information/evidence to backup their claims.

Rather than regurgitating what he said she said.

I'm not trying to start any s*** with anyone.

I just know my butt dyno is only so accurate when it comes to adjustments.
And sometimes it takes me a while to learn/understand/adjust things.
But in the end I'm sure a dyno adjustment would fine tune things to within couple bp/ft lbs.

I know matt has a lot of equipment and tools at his disposal for design/testing/adjustments that us average Joes don't have.
That could get things exactly to spec where he needs them.
And when it gets to us.
We kind of do some coarse tuning at home.

[TominMO]

But it's not quite that simple, due to modern fuel management. You basically have to dance to the tune the ECU wants to play, or it'll kick you into limp-home mode (excessively rich). So you juggle FP, cam timing, ignition timing, the right O2 sensor, to try to make it work. All this is very simple with a non-electronically-programmed carb like a Weber.

[sketchman]

I personally know of one person that had a loss in mpg with the dae cam but power stayd about the same.im not mentioning names on here bc i dont want anything started just meerly letting u guys know.

Some more info if you have it? Was it a carb or EFI?

Knowing that the original positive results were from a carb, I don't think I'd go in expecting to just throw the cam in and be blown away when using it in a different environment than the original. Matt did say this also, early on.

I would expect much greater gain (in mpg) with EFI , cam is designed for 87 octane. Customer reported no major loss of power,MPG was his main objective. Cam will allow leaner AFR, and higher compression ratio on 87 octane with no ping.

He notes that the cam "will allow" conditions that make better MPG numbers. He never really said that it would do wonders all on it's own. And again, that he would "expect" greater gains from EFI. Not that the cam was tested with it and that he was guaranteeing anything. See Tom's thread about how the evils of OEM programmed EFI can thwart your MPG endeavors.

I think we should be careful not to read more into it than what was said. Unless I'm missing something, and I will gladly be educated if that's the case.

EDIT: Looking back again I did find this.

This cam is a direct replacement for an OE cam, no degreeing, adjustable cam sprockets or anything along this line is necessary. Just remove your cam & install this one, reinstall your cam sprocket, line up the timing marks & that's it. The later intake opening/closing events are also known to improve mid & topend HP while proving a flat torque curve that doesn't fall off as RPM rises.

So yeah, it is supposed to work all on its own. Still the original results were from a carbed car. We shall see.

[sketchman]

So....Matt says this cam is profiled like a turbo cam. Which I'm assuming means less overlap. Isn't the point of the header to increase scavenging and pull extra fresh air in during the overlap phase. So without overlap you can't really take advantage of scavenging.

Found some info pertaining to this, so I thought I'd add it here.
Comparing the spec sheet I got with my cam and a sheet I found on the forum I can give a tiny explanation of what was changed. I won't give specifics, because Matt commented on being annoyed that some people were trying to copy his work. Anyway.....
Overlap is less but not non-existent. lift is less, but duration is a TINY bit greater, and valve timing is a bit later.

From my limited understanding it looks like exactly how he described it from the beginning. Cleaner burning bottom end(from the smaller lift and less overlap) but made to still work through the mid range and up(more duration and later valve timing).

[sketchman]

I agree, all a person should have to do is put it in, set their timing, drive around a lot, and check their MPG! Then if yur mileage goes down to say, 29, call Matt and ask him about it. There's a chance he could have made one for mechanical lifters instead of HLA's by mistake though. I will ask him.

And to this.
The cam I got is called B3 HYD/MECH. So no issues getting a hydraulic instead of a mechanical or the opposite.

[1chrisapple]

No valve spring upgrade needed.Developed cam to save purchaser money by not needing costly extras , with much thought towards intake and exhaust cycles and increasing drivability

just thought id point out that no costly extras are needed

[TominMO]

just thought id point out that no costly extras are needed

I think this is true. The problems I was having seem to be, in retrospect, related to vac leaks.

I tried using an adjustable cam gear and found that 0* was indeed the sweet spot, as Matt said. My next run will be at 42 PSI FP, but I want to do one afterwards at stock fuel pressure, to see whether it will play nice there. Then you wouldn't need an adjustable FPR either. The only "extra" that I would recommend is getting the $15 HF vacuum gauge kit, to dial in max efficiency; which could be used for all your cars. I am considering it an essential tuning tool, in conjunction with the timing light.