1991 capri XR2 front brake swap.

[Pu241]

Had all the parts in hand, including Aspire LCAs.

Clarification- Not only where all the parts available and present but at some point in the painfully long day all of them where attached to the car, if not to the car and each other!

Turns out that stock Festy springs are too long. Thinking about cutting one loop out of the front springs. Will this fix the problem?

eurotiva,
Got a question -The XR2 hubs where the ball joint attaches to it has an angle that doesn't permit the LCA's ball joint to mount while the body to LCA is bolted up. Nor, if the body to LCA is bolted up, then the ball joint wont mount up. what if the angle were machined down flat, or at the same angle as the festiva hub ball joint mounting, would this solve the camber issue and alleviate the need use FMS lowering springs or cut OEM ones, or have highly compressed OEM springs.

[eurotiva]

^ I'll have to take a look at mine again. I ended up putting the ball joint and inner bolt, then lifting the whole assembly with a jack. When high enough I put the top bolt in first then the bottom. My wheels were turning all day trying to figure out why you guys were have such problems.

And if it don't fit....Then take a grinder to it.

[chrisofna]

Called The Gregster for advice a couple of times, at different points in the attempt. Turns out that stock Festy springs are too long. Thinking about cutting one loop out of the front springs. Will this fix the problem?.

Exact problem I had, yeah cutting a loop or two out will make em work.

[GenevaDirt]

XR2 rims won't fit the rear with out spacers or low pro tires.

What about with the Aspire rear struts....higher perch...should fit right?

[GenevaDirt]

John/Pu241 and I were attempting to do the Capri XR2 front brake swap on Kittystiva. Had all the parts in hand, including Aspire LCAs. I estimated 3-4 hours for the whole operation. Started at 0630 AM, ended at about 3 PM. 100 degrees and 100% humidity. DIDN'T git 'er done! :banghead:

After John left and I stopped crying, I drank some cold refreshing OJ, and took a cold shower*.

Called The Gregster for advice a couple of times, at different points in the attempt. Turns out that stock Festy springs are too long. Thinking about cutting one loop out of the front springs. Will this fix the problem?

*Because I was hot, not turned on.

Festy never mentioned in any of the posts he made that there was an issue with the springs being to long or having problems with the LCA's.
Very interesting.......

[TominMO]

What about with the Aspire rear struts....higher perch...should fit right?

I have the Aspire rear struts with Festy springs, and the 14x6" Estrellas w/38mm offset. No fitting problems, no spacers.

[TominMO]

Festy never mentioned in any of the posts he made that there was an issue with the springs being to long or having problems with the LCA's.
Very interesting.......

Yeah, that's why I brought this up in this old thread, which I found when searching for tips on getting this done. Maybe Festy already had lowering springs, so it never was an issue for him?

^ I'll have to take a look at mine again. I ended up putting the ball joint and inner bolt, then lifting the whole assembly with a jack. When high enough I put the top bolt in first then the bottom. My wheels were turning all day trying to figure out why you guys were have such problems.

And if it don't fit....Then take a grinder to it.

Greg did help us out with the advice to put in the top strut bolt first (talking about the two lower strut bolts that fit into the knuckle); we were doing just the opposite till we called him. As to the springs, I think he said he already has lowering springs, so that wasn't an issue for him either, same as Festyboy.

[chrisofna]

Festy and I had a long discussion with this... He has FMS springs and forgot to tell people.

[TominMO]

After talking with John extensively about this, I am gonna take the XR2 knuckles down to Greg just before FM4, and we will grind off a little metal on the bottom of the knuckle's ball-joint mounting area. This will reduce the angle and should let us stick 'em in normally, without any spring or camber issues. Might even be able to use Festiva LCAs then, but I'll have the Aspire ones with me anyway.

[bhazard]

I did what euro did. Never thought about grinding anything as I didnt notice that issue, though if they ever get taken apart again I will look into it.

[TominMO]

I did what euro did. Never thought about grinding anything as I didnt notice that issue, though if they ever get taken apart again I will look into it.

Yeah, if you compare the bottom of the knuckle on both a Festy and a Capri knuckle, where the ball joint fits in, you can easily see the difference in angle. That's what's causing all the issues. Doesn't need much ground off either.

[FestYboy]

What about with the Aspire rear struts....higher perch...should fit right?

true, but it really depends on tire diameter/section width.... there's only so much room that you can play with.

[FestYboy]

tom, to get to the bottom of this: spring length doesn't matter, period. here's why: no matter what spring combo you have, the strut determines the unsprung assembly length. i'm running GR-2s which have the same extended length as factory. so that solves that issue.

then there's the LBJ angle that you are finding trouble with, don't grind, there's no need to really. once everything is in place, the LBJ has room to move even with the the suspention completely unloaded... the strut length keeps the joint from reaching it's limits, you just have to get it assembled before this can happen though.

to do everything correctly without issue, assemble the LCA-knuckle combo and attach to swaybar and chassis, then lift to the strut. attach the LOWER bolt on the strut, then use a jack to compress the strut a bit via the rotor and install the upper bolt (the jack will help the upper holes to line up because of the knuckle wanting to fold into the LCA under the weight).

i had the fortunate option of doing all this on a lift with a screwjack to act as the floor jack in your case. thought i recalled mentioning how and in what order i did things in the write up.... guess i should update it.

oh, and why, WHY, WHY didn't john call me when you ran into the issues you were having? he has my number....lol

[TominMO]

tom, to get to the bottom of this: spring length doesn't matter, period. here's why: no matter what spring combo you have, the strut determines the unsprung assembly length. i'm running GR-2s which have the same extended length as factory. so that solves that issue.

then there's the LBJ angle that you are finding trouble with, don't grind, there's no need to really. once everything is in place, the LBJ has room to move even with the the suspention completely unloaded... the strut length keeps the joint from reaching it's limits, you just have to get it assembled before this can happen though.

to do everything correctly without issue, assemble the LCA-knuckle combo and attach to swaybar and chassis, then lift to the strut. attach the LOWER bolt on the strut, then use a jack to compress the strut a bit via the rotor and install the upper bolt (the jack will help the upper holes to line up because of the knuckle wanting to fold into the LCA under the weight).

i had the fortunate option of doing all this on a lift with a screwjack to act as the floor jack in your case. thought i recalled mentioning how and in what order i did things in the write up.... guess i should update it.

oh, and why, WHY, WHY didn't john call me when you ran into the issues you were having? he has my number....lol

Festy, I have to disagree with the idea that spring length doesn't matter. If you have an 18" long spring and a 9" long one, both their unsprung assembly length and their compressed length won't be the same. If the spring length didn't matter, there would be no market for lowering springs and lengthening springs. However, you may well be correct in saying that, for this discussion, it doesn't matter; that the proper assembly procedure and order is the real issue.

The problem I have with the Capri setup is that, as you describe, you need a jack to force the upper strut-to-hub bolt in. This shows that the outside of the spring is going to be more compressed than the inside. Is that not a camber issue? Possible handling and tire-wear problems may well crop up. Also, if the spring is more compressed on one side than the other, maybe this would cause some binding of the strut shaft on the compressed side.

I still feel, unless you can explain why I am wrong, that the best solution is to avoid camber issues, binding issues, and the need to compress the spring by simply grinding something like 2mm off the inside bottom of the balljoint mount. I'm even wondering if we could then use the Festiva LCA instead of the Aspire one. To just assemble the XR2 knuckle onto the Festiva, unmodified by grinding, is to be using the part in a way for which it was not designed--which is what causes the binding and camber issues.

[FestYboy]

ok, yeah, if you have that much differance in spring length i can see you're point, BUT, i'm using an uncompressed strut assembly with either factory or FMS springs installed. in either case the length is the same because of strut travel (the spring is always slightly compressed, even when unloaded).

then on to the jacking issue you describe. so far as i can tell, the spring doesn't care (look at fox body mustangs for an example). yes you may be stressing the strut to one side durring install, but once you're back on the ground, that stress goes away because there's no stress on the LBJ. and really, how often are you having your car sit in an uncompressed state?

again, the binding is only durring install process. once together, there's nolonger any binding in the LBJ area. shaving that 2mm you speak of won't get you anywhere because the knuckle never touches the LCA, the LBJ just runs out of travel.
as for the need for the aspire LCAs, you need them for length to keep the axles from binding in the trans. the XR2 knuckles sit in further than festy knuckles when attached to the festy LCAs so you need to lengthen the LCAs (aspire units) to make up the differance. i tryed using festy LCAs, and it was horrible! install was a nightmare and steering was impossible. swapped in the aspire units and it was like nothing ever happened other than a slight camber gain which was what i was after to begin with for auto-x. aligned the car with 2.1-2.3* of camber on either side. 3 years later and still no wear issues. just have to make sure you're toe is good.