tools to get to do a good DIY wheel alignment.

[ryanprins13]

I know you can use a string and a carpenters square, but I want to set my rear tires as well as do the fronts nicely. I have no where level to park. So which style should I get for measuring the camber? Is a cheap bubble levelish one like this that goes on the rotor for $35 ok? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/New-Magnetic-...YI&vxp=mtr

Or should I get a digital one the goes on the rotor for $270? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/LONGACRE-DIGI...Ow&vxp=mtr

Or should i get a bubble level one that goes on your rim for $200? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/SPC-Performan...Uu&vxp=mtr

I'm not racing with this, just want it close for a nice comfortable long road trip with no tire wear

Then for toe. I could buy toe plates for $85 http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Longacre-Raci...3D191348212924
But I am thinking of finding some really straight boards instead may be a better option. Or should I really go with something like a manufactured toe plate?
Are you guys buying this stuff from local stores or online? If local stores then what kind of stores? All the above prices I posted are CAD but before shipping and shipping to Canada is usually a lot.
Then for rear camber/toe shims where is the best (cheapest) place to buy them? I found that someone posted a link to these, but no size specs on them. I thought you had to get different sizes and that they weren't a one size fits all? http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/m...ral#fragment-3

To level the car I plan to use linolium or ceramic floor tiles, cheets of paper, whatever, to shim up whichever side is lower and use a 5ft level I have.
In some of the threads I read on this forum using laser levels was mentioned but not their purpose. What do you use them for?

[Team Lightning]

I have a set of the longacre plates. They work great. I have a camber meter that I use to check the camber. All were bought off EBay.

[Dragonhealer]

Got to admit, toe plates and a smart camber guage sure make it easier, but I have watched Advancedynamix use a cheap magnetic incline guage from Home Depot set his front up in the paddock at the track.
the most important tool is your head. You are on the right track to make a level plane for the car to sit on! Get a long enough straight board to set your 5ft level on to check your stacks all 6 ways. Make your pieces large enough to roll the car back and forth 8 inches or so. You will do this after each adjustment to settle the chassis so your readings are accurate. If you are shiming the rear for camber/toe, the thrust angle is of vital importance, you can actually eyeball this with the frront wheels perfectly straight and some practice, symmetry side to side, ideally within. 010 inch over the lengh of the car, it can be done!
cheapest rear camber/toe solution is the plastic camber shims from Rockauto, but it is a fussy job to do, patients is a must.
you can make adequate toe plates from thick high density particle board and get 2 identical 10ft tape measures.

[ryanprins13]

I have a set of the longacre plates. They work great. I have a camber meter that I use to check the camber. All were bought off EBay.

ok, what style of camber gauge did you get?

Got to admit, toe plates and a smart camber guage sure make it easier, but I have watched Advancedynamix use a cheap magnetic incline guage from Home Depot set his front up in the paddock at the track.
the most important tool is your head. You are on the right track to make a level plane for the car to sit on! Get a long enough straight board to set your 5ft level on to check your stacks all 6 ways. Make your pieces large enough to roll the car back and forth 8 inches or so. You will do this after each adjustment to settle the chassis so your readings are accurate. If you are shiming the rear for camber/toe, the thrust angle is of vital importance, you can actually eyeball this with the frront wheels perfectly straight and some practice, symmetry side to side, ideally within. 010 inch over the lengh of the car, it can be done!
cheapest rear camber/toe solution is the plastic camber shims from Rockauto, but it is a fussy job to do, patients is a must.
you can make adequate toe plates from thick high density particle board and get 2 identical 10ft tape measures.

Thanks for the tips! A magnetic incline gauge? hmm..
I looked at the shims on rockauto, the ones that do the most only go to 1.5 degrees of camber. Do you use 2 or whats the deal?
do these camber wedges help or do you just need to slot the hole? https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...=1857&jsn=1857
I thought more about the toe plates and figure I should probably buy them rather than trying to make my own.
Thanks!

[TominMO]

I'm not racing with this, just want it close for a nice comfortable long road trip with no tire wear

If this is for your long trip while pulling the trailer, you will be going slow anyway, so less chance of tire wear. Plus, if you set it up for normal-driving usage, the tongue weight of the trailer might throw things off a little, making your efforts moot.

I have never bothered with the rear, and both my cars are fine. Same with the front; set toe-in to zero or no more than 1/8" total, and you should be fine. A long road trip will be the least wearing on your tires, compared to city driving with lots of turns.

The cost of expensive equipment to get everything super-exact might well exceed the savings of slightly reduced tire wear. Just have good quality, long-wearing tires on the car. But if you're doing this as part of alignment-skills development, that's another story, and then maybe it's a worthwhile effort.

[ryanprins13]

tools to get to do a good DIY wheel alignment.

If this is for your long trip while pulling the trailer, you will be going slow anyway, so less chance of tire wear. Plus, if you set it up for normal-driving usage, the tongue weight of the trailer might throw things off a little, making your efforts moot.

I have never bothered with the rear, and both my cars are fine. Same with the front; set toe-in to zero or no more than 1/8" total, and you should be fine. A long road trip will be the least wearing on your tires, compared to city driving with lots of turns.

The cost of expensive equipment to get everything super-exact might well exceed the savings of slightly reduced tire wear. Just have good quality, long-wearing tires on the car. But if you're doing this as part of alignment-skills development, that's another story, and then maybe it's a worthwhile effort.

I have paid for quite a few alignments over the years and i think i get bad tire wear front and back. Have replaced all struts before so its not that. 12in tires seem to last about 30,000km (19-20k miles until their close to the wires and i dont spin the tires much. Even when i quit driving gravel they wear like that. Rears last longer obviously but they still get odd wear and cupping unless i spend a lot of time getting my rear wheel bearings tightened perfectly. (By perfectly it seems to be like 1/16th of a turn less than pinching the bearing so much it stops turning)
Its not so much that i am worried the tires are going to wear right out on this trip but i want to have as much tread as possible left near the end so i still have good traction in rain and stuff. Also these tires are only available to me online. I will buy 5, but getting new ones mid-trip isn't really an option.
These tools will also be used on my other vehicles and possibly my employers truck (no wheel alignment in 350,000km!) my parents and brother could probably use them too.
It is for learning as well, i want to actually know what my alignment is at and what wear it causes. If im going to add negative camber for better handling then i want to know what its at.
Before i do the alignment i will look at why its set with an empty car and see if it would work to set it with the approximate load that i will have in the car. To me it would make sense to set your alignment when the car is loaded how you will drive it. Especially for the rear of a car with an axle like ours. If only the driver stick your weight on the drivers seat, if normally 3-4 adults then set it with that weight and so on. But i haven't looked into that yet.

[Advancedynamix]

I've used crap from home depot to align cars that topped 200mph at Road America, lol. The most valuable part of any alignment is the aptitude of the person doing the work. You'd be surprised how many alignments that are done in state of the art shops are way off spec.

[fastivaca]

A little bit off topic but I thought I'd share my experience with a local shop that has since lost my business. Took the Festiva in for an alignment and reminded them that the only adjustment on a Festiva, realistically, is the toe-in or toe-out. They asked me if the car was lowered and I said "a little bit". They immediately said that the alignment would now cost 50% more because "it's more difficult to do with aftermarket shocks on the car". Went to another local shop and got a discount off their regular price!

I should really learn to do this myself... Charlie, you want to come for a visit and show me how?

Ian

[blake4591]

I do my alignments with about $15 of stuff from homedepot. I use vinyl floor tiles like these http://www.homedepot.com/p/Armstrong...4031/202640065 to stack under the wheels to level the ground. I also use two of them with a coat of grease between them to make bearing plates to set the toe with. For camber I use a plump bob on the fender and measure the top and bottom of the rim, do some quick trig and you have a camber angle. I have toe plates that I brought from Jegs (they have the cheapest set) and they can be handy but they are not required and I don't use them all the time. If you just want to set and forget get it I recommend taking it to a good alignment shop, it'll cost a little more up front but it saves a lot of time and you know it's right. Normally from my experience these are places that also do commercial vehicles and don't talk about how fancy their equipment is.

[jfd64]

I have probably done over 20 successful alighnments with only a tape measure.Maybe I have gotten lucky 20 times but don't see the need for anything more.

[Advancedynamix]

A little bit off topic but I thought I'd share my experience with a local shop that has since lost my business. Took the Festiva in for an alignment and reminded them that the only adjustment on a Festiva, realistically, is the toe-in or toe-out. They asked me if the car was lowered and I said "a little bit". They immediately said that the alignment would now cost 50% more because "it's more difficult to do with aftermarket shocks on the car". Went to another local shop and got a discount off their regular price!

I should really learn to do this myself... Charlie, you want to come for a visit and show me how?

Ian

Yes.

[TominMO]

I have probably done over 20 successful alighnments with only a tape measure.Maybe I have gotten lucky 20 times but don't see the need for anything more.

That's what I used to use too, and I agree.

Now I have a contraption I made with a yardstick and a piece of 1x4 board (because the yardstick wasn't long enough). So essentially I have a 6' long yardstick with measurement markings on only one end. On the board end, I screwed a small 90-degree bracket on the end, to stick into the tire tread, to hold the stick in place. If I have no one helping me, which is usual, I hold that end in place, on the rear side of the tire, with a couple of bricks. Then measure at the rear on the other tire. Then take it off and go measure at the front. Since the arc between front and rear is 90 degrees or less, I try to get the front and rear the same, but will allow 1/16" toe-in.

A little tedious, but easy and free. The tape measure with bricks holding it in place will still work, but it's easier with a more rigid measuring device.

I finally learned how to do this after having my usual tire shop charge me $70 or so to do alignments I wasn't happy with. They would bias it so the car pulled to the left on a level road, because of the pitch in the road where they test-drove it afterward! Seriously lame. Or they did an alignment that then put my steering wheel way off! Made 'em fix that one. That was the end for me with shop alignments.

**********

A timesaver if you are new to this:
You don't ever have to measure at the rear of the tire more than once.
Let's say your rear measurement is 55 1/4" and the front measurement is 55" even, and you want them both to be the same, 55 1/8". Once you adjust the front to 55 1/8", the rear is already there too. Done. If you adjust the front to 55 1/16", then the rear will be at 55 3/16", a 1/8" difference.

These numbers are made up, but you get the idea. and they are not exactly true either. They would be true if you could measure at the exact front and rear edges of the tire, at 3 and 9 o'clock, but you can't. The physically closer on the arc of the tire the measurements are, the more exact you need to be, which is why I only allow a 1/16" difference.

[william]

I used to use 2 tape measures and duck tape to hold them into the tread when working alone .
Now I use a pair of 50 dollar tow plated and I love it. I replaced the tapes with some metric ones that have only mm. And I'm much more accurate. For the cambe I use a long arc wheel mount gauge that we have at work. But I would like to buy my own that attaches to the center of the hub.
What I don't get is how people use a gauge that attaches to the break rotor. I mean when you drop the car everything changes what am I missing here?

[TominMO]

A timesaver if you are new to this:
You don't ever have to measure at the rear of the tire more than once.
Let's say your rear measurement is 55 1/4" and the front measurement is 55" even, and you want them both to be the same, 55 1/8". Once you adjust the front to 55 1/8", the rear is already there too. Done. If you adjust the front to 55 1/16", then the rear will be at 55 3/16", a 1/8" difference.

These numbers are made up, but you get the idea. and they are not exactly true either. They would be true if you could measure at the exact front and rear edges of the tire, at 3 and 9 o'clock, but you can't. The physically closer on the arc of the tire the measurements are, the more exact you need to be, which is why I only allow a 1/16" difference.

Continued:

When you adjust the tie rods CW (clockwise), looking from outside the car, you are turning the threads out; therefore turning the rear of the tire out, therefore toeing in the tire. This is true on both sides, since you are looking at it backwards, from outside the car--looks like righty-tighty, but it's actually lefty-loosey.

If your initial front and rear tire measurements are way off (too toed-in or out), and your steering wheel and tires are straight, you will want to adjust on both sides to keep the steering wheel straight. If the measurements are already close, just do one side. Turning one tie rod (and tire) out turns the steering wheel the toward that tire. (I think.)

Helpful tip: put a little marker on the tie rod, like white paint, so you can easily tell when you have done one revolution, and more easily calibrate a fraction of one rev.

[skeeters_keeper]

I started out setting the toe by using a tape measure to the tread. I had one time where I was having a very frustrating time getting the toe to adjust consistently. I'd make an adjustment, roll the car back and forth to settle the suspension, and it'd be different. Finally I put the car in the air and spun the wheel. There was around 1/8" of axial runout to the treads! They were some cheap Dural tires and I hated them already, after that I hated them more, but I've read that runout to the tire treads is pretty common.
Sidewalls can have a fair amount of runout as well, but I haven't had problems as bad. Taking measurements 24" apart gives you better resolution as well, so I've transitioned to toe plates and can't imagine going back.

Another variation is wheel runout, both axial and radial. Most wheels I've check have had .020-.030" of runout with some being closer to .060". I've heard tolerances on some steel wheels are ~1/8", though that seems really excessive. If you're being real picky you can mark two spots on the wheel that are the same and align them with the axis you're trying to set (horizontal for toe, vertical for camber).

For checking camber I've placed a square on the ground and measured to the top/bottom of the wheel. A little bit of trig can give you the angle. For instance I was setting the camber on some wheels that were 14.25" from bead to bead and I wanted 2.5* of negative camber.

sin(2.5)*14.25"=.622"

Aiming for a 5/8" difference top to bottom on the wheel gives about 2.5* of camber. You could use the step measurement on a pair of calipers to get real close, but I figure I can easily get within 1/16" with a ruler and that's about 1/4 degree... close enough for me.

I'm no expert and I don't race these things, but it seems to work well enough for me.

Now, if someone has a good way to measure and adjust caster...