Building vs Swapping.

[MiltonHavoc]

Lets keep this civil or I will ask it to be closed.

What I am talking about is building the B3 vs Swapping to a different engine.
Since we don't really know the true potential of the B3 it is half false to say that it is not a good base to build.
Vs the Bp, the bolt on power vs dollar is probably in the BP's favor?
Getting the b3 to the level of a BP and still retaining DDability is something I would like to know more on.

What really keeps me from jumping in to a B3 build wholly is not the hp potential or cost or anything. Its the creature comforts.
It gets cold here in Colorado. Not as cold as some of the northern states but we get close. We are a mountainous state so the snow can stay for some time if it feels like it. The B3 has never warmed the car enough for my liking. I have done the coolant flush with cascade, have changed the thermostat etc. I hear you need to swap alternators if you want any kind of a good stereo system. Granted I just want some better 4"s and some 6x9's tactically hidden.

I am all in favor of an N/A BP with good numbers. But I have the means to supercharge a B3 without hacking the engine bay and wiring all to hell and have all the components to mount and secure made.

This is all I have for now.

Discuss!

[sketchman]

On the heat thing, you can stick a 3/4" gate valve in the hose from rad to Tstat housing to limit flow and adjust the heat to wherever you want it. I wouldn't recommend you do it if you aren't certain the system is OK, and that it's really an over cooling prob, but I know for a fact that it will work. I've done it.

I would personally wait on Matt to "finish" what he's doing before I made any choices. But I'm minimalistic to the core. I LOVE the idea of having a built B3 under the hood.

[bobbyspider]

Id love to have a built b3 too, toyota had a lil 1.3 beast it was the 4efte.
B3s are light and great on gas. The weak point in the stock setup is going to be the trans as usual. Everyone here that has boosted their b3 says its a blast to drive! I want to boost my b6 like gauge and see how that feels.

[MiltonHavoc]

True, I guess Matt still does have more stuff to do...,


I'm totally not against buying another festiva and doing both swaps.
But for a daily I just kinda want to know more, if that makes sense.
I bet an high hp NA B3 would be killer though. Also: I do not drag race so I guess that kinda helps if its a factor.

[M3NTAL]

There's no replacement for displacement. Bore stroke valves heads everything is bigger!!

Why spend the time money effort for 130 unreliable horsepower on a b3 when you can swap in 130 reliably hp.

[jesteratc]

The cars are so cheap you could do both.

But on a Serious note.

Everyone i know personally that has fast cars that still handle and feel the way they came new would say to build the stock motor. You don't have to worry about special mounts, no need for special coolant hoses, everything fits stock. As well as if it blows up, you just get another 100$ B3

Mind if i ask what type of supercharger? Roots, or Centrifugal?

[blkfordsedan]

You've already addressed your own questions, really. If money is the main issue, then the BP swap is hard to beat. If you have the funds, then the building the B3 is a viable option (and much more impressive IMO). I'm no expert on Forced Induction, but a belt driven SC takes HP to drive as opposed to a turbo. However, it would be mega-cool and certainly unique. You can always build a healthy N/A B3 and then add the SC...

[M3NTAL]

Im sorry but I have to Respectfully disagree with that comment Brian. If you have the funds why build the b3? What are you building it for? Horsepower. Torque. 2 things that should never be used in the same sentence as b3.

[MiltonHavoc]

Jesteratc basically stated what I'm combating in my head. And yes I seriosy could build both. But what happens when you DO reach the mimits of the b3 and they are sub par ( just being figurative here), or it doesn't have the ability to evolve with your needs. I know the festi is a light car so I imagine that 120-30 ish would be an all around sweet spot for the more competitive ones.

As for forced induction:
Either way is more than possible on the b3, there is enough room in the bay to suffice. I personally am going to go roots because, aside from highway driving , I rarely see my top end. ( although it could use some help)...

[blkfordsedan]

Im sorry but I have to Respectfully disagree with that comment Brian. If you have the funds why build the b3? What are you building it for? Horsepower. Torque. 2 things that should never be used in the same sentence as b3.

LOL, I understand your view. There's always something bigger and badder. I guess the only solid answer is "because you can" or even just to be different. I have about $800 in my rebuilt B6, and I'll be lucky to see the far side of 100hp. I could have done a $300 BP swap and got more performance, but I didn't want to. I wanted the over-all concept of my car to be something that looks stock and could have been a realistic factory option. Same reason I built an FE block for my Galaxie instead of a 460 swap.
However, more to your point, I did decide long ago that if the B3 in my Festy ever died, there would be no reason to spend any time or money on it....not when a B6 is a direct bolt-in. So I'm guilty as well!

[bhazard]

Re: Building vs Swapping.

Im sorry but I have to Respectfully disagree with that comment Brian. If you have the funds why build the b3? What are you building it for? Horsepower. Torque. 2 things that should never be used in the same sentence as b3.

Well matt dickmeyer already proved that wrong by dynoing 266whp with a boosted b3....very few of us are making that with boosted bp's. That's over 200hp per liter dude...

[FestYboy]

^ bingo

[gergorian]

^ bingo

I second that

[M3NTAL]

People dyno'ing big numbers doesn't mean crap brad.

266hp in a 1.3 is not going to last long. Not as long as it would in a BP

[DriverOne]

Re: Building vs Swapping.

Well matt dickmeyer already proved that wrong by dynoing 266whp with a boosted b3....very few of us are making that with boosted bp's. That's over 200hp per liter dude...

And how much would that cost? I've seen a lot of big numbers, but nobody has said, "and it's cheaper than swapping in a BP!" That statement alone is inherently Festiva. I would love to know how many people here have Festivas as primary vehicles and those who have them as toys. I figure the latter group to be the kind to stray from the almost guaranteed stable longevity of a B6 swap with what mild performance it brings for the cost. JM2C.