Headlights

[ryanprins13]

Driving home from work i passed a vehicle with dimmer headlights than mine!!! Some sort of 70's softtop. I thought that was cool.

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[ricko1966]

I do not know if this is relative to festys or not most of my knowledge comes from other marques and I apply it to my festy. Cars with dim headlights,backprobe available voltage to the headlights,should be less than1/2 volt different than available battery voltage.Low voltage, check voltage drop.from negative side of headlight to ground,significant voltage drop, clean or relocate your ground. Check voltage drop on positive side,significant voltage drop on positive side add headlight relays on core support , Doing this from memory no relay in front of me so if anyone sees a mistake please correct me. Relay I believe is bosch number 0332019150 1 per circuit per headlight terminal 30 to the battery. terminal 87 to which ever element on the headlight you are trying to control [high/low] 85 ground to core support. 86 reroute the wire that use to supply which ever circuit you were controling with it. [30=12v constant. 85= ground. 86= trigger. 87= load]if you had low voltage to the headlights this will make a big difference. Like old batteries in a flashlight versus new batteries. If not relavant on a festy maybe that will help a member with a different old whatever.

[ryanprins13]

Ya, our headlight housings arent great, 9004 bulbs arent bright and the voltage drop is a known problem. 9007 upgrade doesnt work all that great. My bulbs are cheap, old and dim. I wasnt intending to drive so much at night this summer.
John glenn has talked about the voltage drop issue a bunch on facebook, not sure if he has on here or what his username is here. But he saw significant improvement with a seperate relay harness, properly sized wires for the headlights and good bulbs.
He had even posted a chart that showed how much the festiva voltage drop lowered the lumens of a halogen bulb i think

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[ricko1966]

Ya, our headlight housings arent great, 9004 bulbs arent bright and the voltage drop is a known problem. 9007 upgrade doesnt work all that great. My bulbs are cheap, old and dim. I wasnt intending to drive so much at night this summer.
John glenn has talked about the voltage drop issue a bunch on facebook, not sure if he has on here or what his username is here. But he saw significant improvement with a seperate relay harness, properly sized wires for the headlights and good bulbs.
He had even posted a chart that showed how much the festiva voltage drop lowered the lumens of a halogen bulb i think

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That is what I was saying if you use seperate relays for each headlamp function. relays on the radiator support, relays controlled by existing headlight wiring, voltage drop is almost nothing. common 4 terminal relays 30 to battery 87 to headlight 85 to ground 86 to existing headlight wire as a trigger.

[theastronaut]

Here's that chart. I'm using dual 87 relays so I only have to use two relays, there's two 87 prongs on each so one relay works for both low beams, or both high beams. GE Nighthawk bulbs as good as it gets for 9004 headlights. Past a relay harness and better bulbs, you need to add auxiliary lamps.

[ricko1966]

Here's that chart. I'm using dual 87 relays so I only have to use two relays, there's two 87 prongs on each so one relay works for both low beams, or both high beams. GE Nighthawk bulbs as good as it gets for 9004 headlights. Past a relay harness and better bulbs, you need to add auxiliary lamps.

Rock on . I've always used the bosch relays I listed 4 prong and ran two wires off a single 87 spade. I will look for some dual 87 relays when I run out of my box of 4 prongs. thanks!

[ryanprins13]

Here's that chart. I'm using dual 87 relays so I only have to use two relays, there's two 87 prongs on each so one relay works for both low beams, or both high beams. GE Nighthawk bulbs as good as it gets for 9004 headlights. Past a relay harness and better bulbs, you need to add auxiliary lamps.

Is this what your talking about? A local store has these on sale for $6 each. One of these will do the high and low of each headlight right?


Or are yours 6 wires or something?

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[ryanprins13]

Nevermind, i misread what you said and the diagram on the relay. So with this #30 gets full battery power, #86 is switched input from either high or low, 85 is ground and 87a goes to one low or high beam and 87 goes to the other. Correct?

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[ricko1966]

Nevermind, i misread what you said and the diagram on the relay. So with this #30 gets full battery power, #86 is switched input from either high or low, 85 is ground and 87a goes to one low or high beam and 87 goes to the other. Correct?

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The way I read that relay is either 87 or 87a will be hot one or the other not both at the same time. Put an ohm meter on #30 and check for continuity to 87 then check 30 to 87a I will bet one has continuity unless the relay is energized then the other has continuity,

[ryanprins13]

Yup, looks to be that way. I found a relay in my shed that appears to be what i need. Ill look at it closer later.
After thinking about it i realized my daytime running lights will no longer work with this relay setup. However they work on the high beams- 7.5 volts.
What i need and want to to is get my low beams better. I drive 2hrs a day at night for 6 months of the year but its a busy highway and i rarely use my high beams. Im happy with my high beams for the 3 miles a day or less i use them.
However the low beams suck even when there is nobody oncoming close by, no rain and no moon. If theres anybody coming at me or rain i cant see and when litereally any vehicle is behind me their low beams are brighter than mine, put my car in a shadow and i can see better from their lights than mine.

So i want to improve just my low beams to keep the drl's i think.
Im thinking of new grounds to both lights, new low beam wiring off a relay, leave the high beam/drl wiring stock.
Ge nighthawk bulbs
Some sort of bright fog light or driving light that will be used with low beams only that will help me see better/farther but not bother other drivers at all.
Any problems with my plan or tips?

I measured headlight voltage. Took wires out of the drivers headlight plug and put em into the bulb, then tested voltage with headlights on.
Low beams with headlights on 14.3v at battery, 13.5v at headlight. No difference between using headlight gnd and battery gnd.
High beams 14.25v at battery, 13.03v at light using its ground and 13.07 using battery ground. So no difference really.
But thats a 1.2v drop for the high beams and a 0.8v drop for the low beams.
Almost 300 lumens lost per bulb (600 total) on the low beams and 450 each (900 total) on the high beams lost.
However the wiring going to the passenger side is longer and has much more voltage drop as verified by others with other vehicles on that candle power forum. Meaning the lumen drop is greater.
It was way too much of a pain trying to measure the voltage for me to want to do the passenger side too.

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[ryanprins13]

Do i did a very quick writeup on how to do the relay harness for anyone interested. I will upload photos of what i bought.

I just did it for the low beams so i could keep my daytime running lights. It made the low beams significantly brighter and brightened the high beams as well because the grounds are larger.
I used 12awg wire, some split loom, heat shrink with glue, a dual-87 relay and a base for it with the terminals for 12awg wire and a fuseholder. I bought enough to do 3 sets- lows, highs, and aux lights but so far have only done the low beams.
I cheaped out on the sockets for the bulbs. I ordered some cheap stuff online hoping for the best but it was all too thin. I ended up splicing the 12awg wire onto the oem sockets as close to the plastic base as i could. Not ideal at all. Buy these instead.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/132404179590

Anyway, makes a big difference.
These are supposed to be the best bulbs you can get for the festiva.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BQWQLOK/?tag=2402507-20

Then get your lights aimed and thats about as good as it gets without aux lights...

So 12awg grounds straight to the battery. 12awg wire from the battery positive to the relay. 12awg power to each headlight. 14awg signal wire to the relay. Crimp connections and dual wall heat shrink with single wall heat shrink over top.


12awg wire next to oem wire



Socket thats on my cars harness unplugged, but the high beam wire is going to relay harness socket.

Signal wire from passenger side headlight socket.

Relay isnt mounted yet.

Wire length is in meters, prices are all CAD.

The relays are $6 each...

The sockets and terminals for the relay were pretty pricy i thought.


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[UglyEd]

So i have read all of this and i have read about the led bulbs for our cars...i am now working midnights so all my driving to and from work is dark now (2 hrs)....need to improve the headlamps somehow.... so what would be the better direction to go...fix wires/relays or led...or both? Whats everyones opinion? Thanks all.

Uglyed and The Steve

[ryanprins13]

So i have read all of this and i have read about the led bulbs for our cars...i am now working midnights so all my driving to and from work is dark now (2 hrs)....need to improve the headlamps somehow.... so what would be the better direction to go...fix wires/relays or led...or both? Whats everyones opinion? Thanks all.

Uglyed and The Steve

Led's and HID's are illegal because they put the beam in a different spot and arent focused properly blinding other drivers. I tried HID's but had to aim them so low to avoid blinding people there was almost no point.
So on your drive do you use mostly high beams or mostly low beams?
If its mostly high beams just get a pair of aux lights and a relay harness for them. John glenn has some very nice ones.
If its mostly low beams then its worth making sure your housings are in good shape, buying new ones if their not. Getting those phillips bulbs i linked. Doing the relay harness. Aiming your lights properly and then seeing what you think.
If thats not enough then look at aux low beams. They are more rare and harder to find but it was what i was going to do.

Also an option is to get the different headlights and grille from the festiva store. They take h4 bulbs and have a much better pattern. But that is $300+ iirc
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[ryanprins13]

Cant complain about what that looks like

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[theastronaut]

If you've ever used a Maglite then you know how the beam pattern changes by moving the location of the bulb. The people that designed the headlight housing put the bulb (with low and high filaments) in just the right spot to make the best beam pattern possible. Changing to HID or LED changes the location and size of the light source in relation to the reflector and lens. So you might have a much brighter light source but the new beam pattern it creates actually scatters the light and makes it less concentrated where you need it.