Big brakes and wheel bearing question

[greywolf200]

Any garage with a press should be able to change the rotors and bearings for you. I took the steering knuckle off my 88 festiva and took them to the local garage and had the bearings and rotors changed for 20 bucks per wheel. they used a hydrolic press to separate the assembly and put it back together again.

Unfortunately, I don't know of anyone in the area that I'd trust to be sharpe enough to dissemble and reassemble them properly. Getting work like this done around here has become a real problem. Local mechanics read the codes, replace a part then scratch their heads. Show them a carburetor and their eyes cross....:highly_amused:

I know there is a guy on the forum doing bearings, but my car is my DD and if I encountered a bearing problem, I'd be out of transportation until I could get parts from him.

Thanks for the suggestion,

[sketchman]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is the problem with "bolt on rotors". I'n aware of them, but no experience.

Thanks,

Well imagine your rotors are worn out and you need new ones. With floating (modern style like the aspire and rio) rotors, this is an easy noninvasive job.
Not so much with captive/bolt-on ones.

It's kinda like the video below, but not exactly. Same principles involved, though. It's like with captive rotors the design guys sat down and said, "OK, now how difficult can we make this to replace?" Then later, after many beatdowns from disgruntled backyard mechanics, they said, "OK, now let's just use common sense with this one."

[greywolf200]

I'm guessing the engineers that designed this work next door to the ones whose job is to hide the inside door handles on new cars.....:highly_amused:

Well imagine your rotors are worn out and you need new ones. With floating (modern style like the aspire and rio) rotors, this is an easy noninvasive job.
Not so much with captive/bolt-on ones.

It's kinda like the video below, but not exactly. Same principles involved, though. It's like with captive rotors the design guys sat down and said, "OK, now how difficult can we make this to replace?" Then later, after many beatdowns from disgruntled backyard mechanics, they said, "OK, now let's just use common sense with this one."

[greywolf200]

Bhazard is the only one I know of to have done the 323/Capri Big Brake upgrade & apply it to the Festiva. It solves the captured rotor problem and offers more rotor and swept area



It's really not that involved. If you're not up to the job, I sell machined hubs or even whole bolt on Big Brake upgrades depending on your budget

What keeps a poor little Festiva from doing endo's when you stand on those brakes?

[crazyrog17]

Traction and a rear end

[bhazard]

They aren't that strong...

[Advancedynamix]

"Floating rotor" refers to a two piece rotor, typically with an aluminum "hat" and a steel disc that is fastened loosely to the hat. The rotors on aspires as well as the majority of production street cars are not floating discs. On these cars, the calipers float. Floating rotors are used with solid mounted calipers that have opposing pistons.

[sketchman]

Huh. That's weird. The same design as a "loose fitting drop on?" rotor is called floating when it's applied to drums, so I assumed. Strange.

[zoom zoom]

"Floating rotor" refers to a two piece rotor, typically with an aluminum "hat" and a steel disc that is fastened loosely to the hat. The rotors on aspires as well as the majority of production street cars are not floating discs. On these cars, the calipers float. Floating rotors are used with solid mounted calipers that have opposing pistons.

thank you for clarifying that for me!

[sketchman]

So what are they called? Porkpie rotors?

[sketchman]

Can't find a definitive answer on it, but it seems they are calling the ones Charlie refers to as "floating", "full floating" and OEM common sense designed drop on(whatever), "floating".

Still would like to know what they say when they decide they don't need "full floaters" but they definitely don't want captive ones when they are designing a car. Plain rotors, normal rotors, I even saw "frozen rotors", though I think that was half jokingly when comparing to full floaters.

[greywolf200]

"Floating rotor" refers to a two piece rotor, typically with an aluminum "hat" and a steel disc that is fastened loosely to the hat. The rotors on aspires as well as the majority of production street cars are not floating discs. On these cars, the calipers float. Floating rotors are used with solid mounted calipers that have opposing pistons.

I believe, at one time, you had Capri hubs and switched to Aspire. Knowing you, I'll bet that had something to do racing, how did the problems/advantages relate to a street car?

Thanks,

[Rocketman]

They aren't that strong...

I suspect you might need to go to a larger master cylinder then, do you have the stock one in there? I'm eying up the EVO BMC upgrade that the one GTX guy on ClubProtege did

[frankenfester]

Okay, so Festiva brake discs are skinny little things and the bearings require a specialist to replace properly, big problem.
Inquiring minds want to know,

that's not necessarily true. i've removed mine with a pitman puller, and pressed them in with a bearing/race driver set from harbor freight tools. they lasted for about 3 years before i replaced them again. when i replaced them, i cold chiseled the bearing off the spindle, and the same for the races in the knuckle. replacing the races, i used the old race as a shock absorber, grabbed a socket that fit the edge of it, and used a big hammer to ram them in place same for the bearing back onto the spindle. it's a very simple process. sure it requires some patience, and a couple times of practice (i'd recommend with old ones) but i can do either side in about 20 minutes a piece. definitely beats taking it to a mechanic (the mistake i made, that caused the ones he put on to seize) and paying all that extra money.
Timkens are like $11 a piece, and last a long while, and have warranty. The only way you'd really screw them up is not packing them properly with (a decent, and i use mobil 1 synthetic-the red stuff) grease. if you do all that right, and they roar, or make any noise, there's another problem besides the bearings. same with the rear, but they are much simpler to install/remove.
as far as the cruddy 12"ers go, i'd definitely upgrade to something stock from another car, or aftermarket from discount tire, if you have on. i've put about 8 different sets of those 12" kuhmos on in the past year alone, and get about 5-6000 miles out of them before theres a bald patch somewhere (and before it's said that there's a suspension problem, ive replaced all the struts, strut mounts, bushings, control arms, cv axles, and tie rods). it's just that having a tire so skinny and so small, depending on how you drive, makes the tires like erasers on asphalt. i could go 50 miles on brand new kuhmos, get out, and run my hand along the tire and come back with dust reminiscent of a rubber pencil eraser.
I definitely say Discount Tire is the way to go. As of, hopefully later today, they'll be installing a set of 14" Konig Vipers (8 spoke), 35-38mm (not sure which) offset along with Falken Sincera SN-828's that are 175/65/r14. Hopefully that will solve the tire problems i've been having. But definitely give them a call if there's one near you, and ask about your options. they are super knowledgeable, and do rotations, balancing, and (in most cases) replace the tire if something (tread wear,blow out, nails, etc.) were to happen to it, for free. you just pay for the new certificate on the new tire, which is like 11$ with tax.

[Advancedynamix]

I believe, at one time, you had Capri hubs and switched to Aspire. Knowing you, I'll bet that had something to do racing, how did the problems/advantages relate to a street car?

Thanks,

First, my track car is very much a street car. It serves as a daily driver, a pickup truck and my cross country R.V.. It's comfortable and reliable ( well, it was until I cracked a piston with 16psi of boost at the track). This isn't a race car, it passes emissions, and it's 100% street legal. I put an average of 25k miles of street usage on Tweak a year.

With that said, the aspire brakes are great on the street and on the track. I wouldn't suggest the PFC pads for typical street cars because they do not bite as well as typical organic pads until they warm up. I noticed no negative results from downsizing from the Capri xr2 brakes. I have warped my rotors once while showing up an e46 M3 on us40 east going over the smokey mts, but they straightened themselves out after a few heat cycles. That has been the only issue. I changed from Capri brakes to aspire brakes because I needed to run 13" wheels to be able to fit quality track tires under the stock fenders. I don't regret this decision one bit.