Roll cage pictures needed

[mikemounlio]

A welder from work is getting a bender and needs practice. He said he will build my cage and do my exhaust work for the price of materials. Does anyone have any good cage pictures? I would think its best to keep it simple for now. I will have the dash out so it can be a full cage. Any pictures would help

[Advancedynamix]

These were taken while we were building the cage in our LeMons car. After this we put the cross bar in the hoop, vertical supports in the door bars and a support bar/grab bar in the halo. Pretty basic cage.

[mikemounlio]

What to do that in mine?

[Advancedynamix]

I wish we didn't have to have it in our car. This car will never handle as good as an uncaged Festiva.

[mikemounlio]

I wish we didn't have to have it in our car. This car will never handle as good as an uncaged Festiva.

So for a daily driver/autox car what is the beast plan for safety? If i ever crash on the street i dont want to be just dead...

[Dragonhealer]

Harness bar and a 7point harness.
Charlie has a great design for a harness bar.

[Advancedynamix]

A roll cage is only safe if you're fully harnessed in to a proper FIA race seat and wearing a helmet. This isn't practical in a street car because you can't look for traffic at intersections and while merging. If you aren't tightly harnessed in with a helmet on then a cage will most likely cause more harm than good. The cars original structure was designed to absorb impact and protect the driver. Adding a bunch of steel to the car in random places is very counterproductive to the energy absorption properties of the car. What this means is, you're going to feel an impact much more severely with a cage, and if you aren't tightly strapped to a proper seat, that crash energy could tear you to pieces, literally. Cars are designed to squish for a very good reason.
The best way to ensure your safety and the safety of those around you is to be responsible. Take driving seriously. Learn proper car control in a safe environment and never underestimate the variables which could be present on public roads. If you set a Festiva up properly, and take driving seriously, you'll be in the safest car on the road. These cars use very little space on the road, so avoiding obstacles is much easier than with larger, heavier cars. These cars can stop and turn much faster than any other car on the road. The strongest steel in the world can't protect a dangerous driver.

[mikemounlio]

A roll cage is only safe if you're fully harnessed in to a proper FIA race seat and wearing a helmet. This isn't practical in a street car because you can't look for traffic at intersections and while merging. If you aren't tightly harnessed in with a helmet on then a cage will most likely cause more harm than good. The cars original structure was designed to absorb impact and protect the driver. Adding a bunch of steel to the car in random places is very counterproductive to the energy absorption properties of the car. What this means is, you're going to feel an impact much more severely with a cage, and if you aren't tightly strapped to a proper seat, that crash energy could tear you to pieces, literally. Cars are designed to squish for a very good reason.
The best way to ensure your safety and the safety of those around you is to be responsible. Take driving seriously. Learn proper car control in a safe environment and never underestimate the variables which could be present on public roads. If you set a Festiva up properly, and take driving seriously, you'll be in the safest car on the road. These cars use very little space on the road, so avoiding obstacles is much easier than with larger, heavier cars. These cars can stop and turn much faster than any other car on the road. The strongest steel in the world can't protect a dangerous driver.

So how about a picture or two of a good harness bar setup? I have seen 2 different kinda floating around. One on the pillar and one just under the rear window.

[ryanprins13]

Regular car you get hurt in crashes over 60mph. You get hurt bad in bad crashes at or over that speed. Caged car keeps you from getting squished by the car itself but you get hurt worse at low speed collisions than you would without the cage. All the force of the collision gets transferred to you instead of the car. Unless your planning to be really stupid on the street you actually dont want a cage. Like he said above^ properly strapped in so the cage helps makes you more dangerous on the road because you cant see easily enough


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[mikemounlio]

Got it no cage. so i still need a good harness bar setup. Any good ideas on that?

[ryanprins13]

Roll cage pictures needed

Even if you made your whole car out of boron steel thick enough that it wouldnt crush your confidence level would go up far enough that you would end up crashing at speeds high enough that internal injuries would kill you. Doesn't take a lot actually to do that

Thats what makes festivas safer. You know youll die if you do something stupid so you drive safer. Other vehicles give you a false confidence and then dont protect you like you think they will

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[Festiver]

A roll cage is only safe if you're fully harnessed in to a proper FIA race seat and wearing a helmet. This isn't practical in a street car because you can't look for traffic at intersections and while merging. If you aren't tightly harnessed in with a helmet on then a cage will most likely cause more harm than good. The cars original structure was designed to absorb impact and protect the driver. Adding a bunch of steel to the car in random places is very counterproductive to the energy absorption properties of the car. What this means is, you're going to feel an impact much more severely with a cage, and if you aren't tightly strapped to a proper seat, that crash energy could tear you to pieces, literally. Cars are designed to squish for a very good reason.
The best way to ensure your safety and the safety of those around you is to be responsible. Take driving seriously. Learn proper car control in a safe environment and never underestimate the variables which could be present on public roads. If you set a Festiva up properly, and take driving seriously, you'll be in the safest car on the road. These cars use very little space on the road, so avoiding obstacles is much easier than with larger, heavier cars. These cars can stop and turn much faster than any other car on the road. The strongest steel in the world can't protect a dangerous driver.

Haven't these cars been known to squish too much and involve passengers into the squish? Ive heard a bunch of stories with how festivas crumble with any force (reason A of why festivas are so light) I would like to daily festivas in the future as many people do but once I have kids if I don't trust my festivas structure in a crash to Volvo I go

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[Advancedynamix]

Running into a solid object at speed in any car is a bad idea, a Festiva or a Volvo. These cars are much lighter and actually MORE rigid than most consumer cars. They have a pretty effective crumple structure, but they weren't designed to protect the driver from ultra high speed collisions. However, your typical minivan is more dangerous than a Festiva at high speeds. The more a vehicle weighs, the more that weight is multiplied by inertia in a collision. A heavy vehicle will put more force into crushing itself in a crash. Furthermore, heavy vehicles keep bouncing and spinning longer than lightweight vehicles.
If heavy gauge steel was the answer to safety, then there would be a much much higher causulty rate in Formula 1 racing. The truth is that engineering is more effective than heavy materials. The Festiva chassis is a well engineered box for it's size. All in all though, avoiding collisions should be more of a concern than trying to survive them.

[Advancedynamix]

Even if you made your whole car out of boron steel thick enough that it wouldnt crush your confidence level would go up far enough that you would end up crashing at speeds high enough that internal injuries would kill you. Doesn't take a lot actually to do that

Thats what makes festivas safer. You know youll die if you do something stupid so you drive safer. Other vehicles give you a false confidence and then dont protect you like you think they will

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This.

[Advancedynamix]

So how about a picture or two of a good harness bar setup? I have seen 2 different kinda floating around. One on the pillar and one just under the rear window.