Advanced Suspension Mods

[Advancedynamix]

The vw springs are roughly 3.70 o.d. and 2.96 i.d.

[jdobbs86]

Thanks! I decided to do a little digging on the google machine which yielded a VW forum post claiming the following rough specs for MK1 springs:

Front

Length - 28cm / Top OD - 10.3CM / Top ID - 8.0cm / Bottom OD - 13.6CM / Bottom ID - 11.3cm

Rear

Length - 34cm / OD 9.8cm / ID - 8.0cm

(citation: http://www.clubgti.com/showthread.ph...rd-spec-needed)

Using fractional measurements for some reason (i kid...i kid) that gives us roughly a 3 7/8 outside diameter for the stock MK1 spring. Which means I might be pretty close to fitting on the MK1 seat with the miata springs. A concern might be the overall length and design of the seat. If the MK1 seat is sort of flat-ish i might be alright given the miata spring packings .

[Dragonhealer]

Sure jdobbs86, "spring packing" is an English carry-over from my British car days. Spring isolator or insulator would be the American terms. The Festiva ones are always perished out here, and not readily available.
I have not tried the NB rear spring, but it ought to go in too.Don't go for more spring rate than you need, but feel free to go stiffer on a long bump stop. You will want about 1-1/2" travel/space when unladen before the bump stop comes into play, and yes, this is about a 2" lift in the rear. This allows the suspension to work well when unladen. It's simple enough to try it out (except those pesky trim panels inside)

The outside diameter of these springs is apx. 4-1/8, 4-3/16. I don't know the size of the VW springs, perhaps Charlie can elucidate?

[jdobbs86]

If the Aspire swap includes the struts, They may actually lower the car ,which would be a problem.
My solution, on a pennies budget, in the front Aspire knuckles, hubs and brakes, on stock Festiva struts and springs, with rubber spring packings for 2000 Miata (lower) and URO bumper 357412303F (these are a little longer than the URO 1H0412303B which I tried first). In the rear, Aspire beam complete, but I cut out the added torsion bar , and stock Festiva struts and springs with the Miata spring packings and URO bumper 1J0512131B.
This works amazingly well, each spring packing and bumper is less than $5. When I set up to tow a trailer, the only change I made was to swap out the rear springs for 90-93 Miata rear springs. (this also works well if you habitually haul 2 engines + crap )

Sorry if I'm being a bit thick, and please pardon me for getting lost in a 40+ page thread. I'm just making sure that I understand what is referred to here as a "spring packing". Is that in reference to what I would call a spring seat or isolator? (little rubber doughnut that the coil spring sits on?).
Also I gather the miata springs give a bit of a lift in the rear? could the same springs be used on mk1 shocks or even the stiffer ~118lb springs from an NB (NA miata springs are something like 95lbs)?

[Dragonhealer]

I'm using my Festiva as a heavy hauler... Looking to upgrade the front suspension. What is the best route? Can someone point me to an existing thread? My 13" tires are rubbing when I turn. Looking for the simplest solution. 1.6l with full aspire upgrade. Thanks

If the Aspire swap includes the struts, They may actually lower the car ,which would be a problem.
My solution, on a pennies budget, in the front Aspire knuckles, hubs and brakes, on stock Festiva struts and springs, with rubber spring packings for 2000 Miata (lower) and URO bumper 357412303F (these are a little longer than the URO 1H0412303B which I tried first). In the rear, Aspire beam complete, but I cut out the added torsion bar , and stock Festiva struts and springs with the Miata spring packings and URO bumper 1J0512131B.
This works amazingly well, each spring packing and bumper is less than $5. When I set up to tow a trailer, the only change I made was to swap out the rear springs for 90-93 Miata rear springs. (this also works well if you habitually haul 2 engines + crap )

[Advancedynamix]

This thread offers the best option for ultimate versatility and fine tuning to specific needs. However, if you do a lot of hauling, your rear suspension needs just as much attention, if not more. Dragonhealer has composed a very effective solution for the hard working festiva. He uses Miata rear springs and long VW bump stops.

[yogaslackers]

I'm using my Festiva as a heavy hauler... Looking to upgrade the front suspension. What is the best route? Can someone point me to an existing thread? My 13" tires are rubbing when I turn. Looking for the simplest solution. 1.6l with full aspire upgrade. Thanks

[Advancedynamix]

Makes perfect sense when you describe things like that. But one begs to ask "You live in the middle of the desert! What do you know about a Fox Body Mustang in a snowstorm?"

LOL I know. you used to live in New England

20 years in Western Maine. My first jobs included lots of shoveling snow, which is why I now live in Arizona. Shoveling sunshine is much easier on the back. Haha

[TominMO]

I would stack them 1/4" on both. Be sure to take this stack into account when you tighten the top mount. Don't squish the rubber mounts too much as this is an important pivot point.

Great info (again), thanx.

[Advancedynamix]

I would stack them 1/4" on both. Be sure to take this stack into account when you tighten the top mount. Don't squish the rubber mounts too much as this is an important pivot point.

[TominMO]

If you get fender washers with the right hole size for shaft, but small enough that they rest on the sleeve that the bump stop usually locates on the VW. Get 2 sizes, one that fits inside the spring and the other that sits on top of the spring and stack them thick enough to make the same thing I have made on the lathe. Or PM Cliferton, he might be able to make a run of the new style of spring hats.

I do run spacers depending on the wheels I'm running. These BBS wheels don't require them because they are ET15mm offset and are actually very thick where they bolt on so they require long studs or long BBS wheel bolts. I use ARP press in studs.

Thanks, good info. Fender washers tend to be pretty thin, so I could drill them to the right hole size, if needed, to rest on that sleeve thing. How thick are the two sections, the one that fits inside the spring and the one that fits over it?

[Advancedynamix]

Charlie, two questions about the above pic:
1. You once mentioned that instead of your custom-made upper spring perch for the coil-over springs, someone could fab up the same thing with washers. Could you explain that process in more detail?
b. Since you presumably do not use spacers, why are you using such long studs? And are they screw-in or press-in?

If you get fender washers with the right hole size for shaft, but small enough that they rest on the sleeve that the bump stop usually locates on the VW. Get 2 sizes, one that fits inside the spring and the other that sits on top of the spring and stack them thick enough to make the same thing I have made on the lathe. Or PM Cliferton, he might be able to make a run of the new style of spring hats.

I do run spacers depending on the wheels I'm running. These BBS wheels don't require them because they are ET15mm offset and are actually very thick where they bolt on so they require long studs or long BBS wheel bolts. I use ARP press in studs.

[TominMO]

Charlie, two questions about the above pic:
1. You once mentioned that instead of your custom-made upper spring perch for the coil-over springs, someone could fab up the same thing with washers. Could you explain that process in more detail?
b. Since you presumably do not use spacers, why are you using such long studs? And are they screw-in or press-in?

[Gomez]

Makes perfect sense when you describe things like that. But one begs to ask "You live in the middle of the desert! What do you know about a Fox Body Mustang in a snowstorm?"

LOL I know. you used to live in New England

[Advancedynamix]

I just got back from a thorough road test of the rear MK1 VW Golf shocks on a Festiva with 105lb10" springs. The test was conducted with Pedro, over a wide range of road conditions. The tires used were 175/50-13 Nankang NS2 street tires with 26lbs of air in them.

Highway: Wonderfully stable. Very comfortable and the rear absorbs on ramp transitions and irregularities with much more refinement and stability than a stock Festiva suspension without being harsh at all.

Fast Road: With more twisty turns and bumps this setup really shines. The car feels planted and stable. The car rides smoother than stock over most road imperfections.

Technical asphalt: Very nimble and confidence inspiring is my best description. The rear absorbs most of the bumps with comfort with the exception of nasty speed bumps or big pot holes. Lets face it, the stock setup soaks up horrible road conditions better than most ATV's do, so some compromise must be made here for road stability. This would be better with a higher profile/ narrower tire, but that would be a compromise on the faster end of the drive.

Gravel roads/light trails: At slow speeds this setup is comfortable and solid, but watch out at high speed. These rear shocks are valved too slow for fast gravel use unless your a master at FWD drifting. At around 55-60mph things get dicey and the rear end skeeters like a 5.0 foxbody in a snowstorm. This will bite you hard if you don't know it's going to happen because things escalate quickly. Basically, the valving is too stiff for these springs over high speed bumps, like washboards. This causes the suspension to sort of lock up instead of work because it "packs". It takes a minute of washboards and then it goes hard and hello icecapades! Don't run this setup if your daily trip includes washboarded gravel roads. Also, this setup will drop the ride height of the car a couple inches from stock. Still plenty of room for light ATV trails and most gravel roads, but watch out for high centering on obstacles that a stock Festiva could tromp over like a baws. Shock articulation is good, and the car still conforms to the trail well, but not as good as a stock Festiva. If you love to drive on ATV paths with your Festiva then you should just use stock replacement KYB shocks in the rear.