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    bravekozak
    This is now more then a hobby!

  • bravekozak
    replied
    Why were these gaskets only available on Aspires?
    Do they go in between the top hat and tower?
    bravekozak
    This is now more then a hobby!
    Last edited by bravekozak; 11-26-2016, 03:26 PM.

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  • Advancedynamix
    Modifier

  • Advancedynamix
    replied
    Originally posted by chrisofna View Post
    That pretty much explains it! Thanks a lot! I'm surprised the front coilover valving matches up the rear so well too.
    Yes, we are really lucky here too. The length and valving rates work better on the Festiva with these light spring rates than they do on the VW cars with the springs they come with. Lol. I've driven more than one VW on Raceland coilovers, and they aren't very impressive. The spring rates are too high and the valving is too soft for the MK2 and way too soft for the MK3. Kinda funny how they are perfectly matched for a car that these companies don't make a shock for. We're also very lucky that these are the cheapest threaded body coilovers for any car anywhere. Try to find a 200 dollar set of coilovers, brand new with free shipping! Ha! And the quality of the parts is on par with much more expensive setups.
    I just hope the price keeps going down and we don't lose this source any time soon. With proposed terrifs on imported goods, I have a feeling this is going to be the lowest price we will see ever again though. I don't even know how they make these things and ship them so cheap.

    Leave a comment:

  • chrisofna
    Senior Member

  • chrisofna
    replied
    That pretty much explains it! Thanks a lot! I'm surprised the front coilover valving matches up the rear so well too.

    Leave a comment:

  • Advancedynamix
    Modifier

  • Advancedynamix
    replied
    ^ yeah, they are a lot longer.

    So here is the deal with the MK1 vw rear KYB shocks and why they are a lot better than a threaded body coilovers for our cars;
    1. The length does matter.
    The stock (Aspire/Festiva) fitment KYB shocks are not a bad match for the Festiva, but they are too long. Even at the stock ride height, the stock shocks have too much droop distance (The distance the suspension drops when you raise the car). This droop is the number 1 cause of excessive and uncontrolled body roll. Reducing the droop, will reduce the body roll without the need for stiffer springs or anti roll bar. This means you can have a nice soft ride and still rail corners like a slot car. The mk2 rear coilovers are actually longer than the stock Festiva shocks, so that means they are worse than stock. The mk1 golf KYB shocks are about 3" shorter than stock FESTIVA shocks, which is just right for most street cars and track cars.
    2: Girth isn't helpful in the rear.
    The rear threaded body coilovers use 60mm springs. These springs take up valuable room that we need for our tires. These cars don't have much room in the rear wheel arches and wider springs, on wider shocks is a lose lose situation.
    The KYB Mk1 vw shocks are very thin, and that allows us to fit the small body adjuster sleeves on them so we can use the skinny 1 7/8 diameter springs. This means we have enough room to fit wider wheels and tires if we want to. This is very important if you want to put track tires on your car, as the only commonly available size that fits the fenders of a Festiva (sorta) is 185/60-13.
    3.Control that motion.
    The shock valving of the MK1 VW KYB shocks is good. I mean it's really really good. It's by total coincidence that these parts work so well together, but they do. I've driven a lot of professionally set up race cars and this combo never ceases to impress me. We got lucky here. You can build rear shocks for your car for under 200 bucks that make a bigger difference than paying Moton to build 10,000 dollar shocks for your GT3rsr. Yes, I've driven both. No, I don't get kickbacks from KYB or southwest speed. I do get my kicks from this setup though.
    4: Throwing the weight around.
    These cars benifit greatly from reducing weight in the rear end. Sir Mix a Lot wouldn't like going all out in a Festy, but the rest of us love it. The more weight that's in the rear, the more likely the car is to oversteer when pushed to it's limits, and the harder that oversteer is to control.
    Oversteer, in a FWD car? What? Ooooooh yes young Skywalker. The force is strong and it will spin you to the dark side if you don't know how to use it. The MK2 (or even MK1, or Tien for the Festiva) rear coilovers are much heavier than the kyb mk1 shocks with small body sleeves and 1 7/8" springs. This setup is lighter than stock. Think of them as double lite sabers. It's like cheating.
    5: Fitting all that in there.
    The bottom shock mount of the Festiva is about an eight of an inch narrower than the VW. This requires that you grind off almost a quarter inch from one side of the VW mk1 kyb shocks and put the supplied washer/spacer on the other side to space the shock inward. The mk2 coilovers will be harder to fit, because the rubber bushing is too wide and then the shock body hits the beam if it articulates (that's assuming that you're running the suspension high enough for the shocks to even work at all, which would be higher than stock.)
    Advancedynamix
    Modifier
    Last edited by Advancedynamix; 11-21-2016, 02:58 PM.

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  • chrisofna
    Senior Member

  • chrisofna
    replied
    Ahh. Sorry I'm not seeing the correlation between the longer bodies and body roll? Or is it because of how the suspension unloads on the inside of the corner?

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  • mikemounlio
    Senior Member

  • mikemounlio
    replied
    The mk2 is longer and will allow more body roll. You can use them 100% but its not the best setup possible. If you want the best dont run the longer ones. If you just want a bit of drop and a better handling ride run the longer ones.

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  • Team Lightning
    (bebandit)

  • Team Lightning
    replied
    Mk2 rear struts are longer than the mk1 rear struts is what I was told.

    Leave a comment:

  • chrisofna
    Senior Member

  • chrisofna
    replied
    Got a question: Why couldn't you use the MK2 Rear coilovers and just switch the springs? Scrolled through the thread but couldn't find a reasoning.

    Glad to see people still working to get these cars to handle like supercars, haha.

    Leave a comment:

  • Advancedynamix
    Modifier

  • Advancedynamix
    replied
    It's truly my pleasure. Great car + great people= Win win.

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  • fudge
    replied
    Advancedynamix thank you for all your time and effort you put into Festivas and for posting information and advice on here for the public. I have seen your videos, threads, photo album, and gotten responses from you on here and I really admire your work and your Festivas! I can't wait to do things to my car that would not be possible without your help. Keep on rockin!

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  • Advancedynamix
    Modifier

  • Advancedynamix
    replied
    Originally posted by blake4591 View Post
    In addition to this the mk3 KYB struts are about 1" to 2" longer when fully compressed than the hottuning coil overs. I had a set of each and did some side by side comparisons about 6 months ago. I don't think I have any pictures but if I have the coilovers off my car this winter I will get some pictures.
    This is one of the big reasons to choose The threaded body coilovers. The valving of the Hottuning shocks is also better matched to the spring rates that I suggest. If you change the dampeners, then you'll have to also accommodate with the springs.

    The parts that I've suggested are not just a list of crap that kinda works to lower the car. This list is the result of 4 years and over 200k miles of testing on everything from road race tracks to back trails through the blue ridge mountain range. This setup has been tested and improved through a rigorous process. The chassis balance and vehicle comfort have been the main goal in all this testing. I've been setting up suspension systems for over 20 years now, and this setup is the result of that experience and passion for a balanced and compliant chassis. The Festiva is one of the best handling vehicles I've come across and that's why I've devoted so much time and effort to dialing this in. To put things in perspective, my Festiva regularly posts much faster lap times around many road courses than high dollar sports cars with custom built suspension from Ohlins, Penskee, JRZ and Moton. Even my own high dollar sports car with custom tuned brand name coilovers can't hold a line anything like my Festiva with this suspension. It's really that good. I don't get any kickbacks from any of the suppliers that I suggest, and I don't sell any of this stuff. I simply want more people to have this experience. If you cut corners on this setup, you are assuming that I didn't try my hardest to make this cheaper. I have tried to make this as cheap as possible, and that's why I freely give all the information to build these kits, and I don't try to hide this stuff so that I can profit. In fact, I tried buying a bunch of parts in bulk and building the kits to sell to people to save more money, but it ended up costing me so much time that I can't justify doing it again. This is the bottom line, right here. This is not "race car only" suspension. It improves the ride and handling and safety of any Festiva. My only warning is that the rear MK1 shocks are not good for washboard dirt roads. Don't exceed 45mph on washboard dirt roads unless you are a very experienced drifter.

    End Rant
    Advancedynamix
    Modifier
    Last edited by Advancedynamix; 11-16-2016, 10:54 PM.

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  • fudge
    replied
    Man you have no idea how excited I am to do this! When I put my foot on my bumper to tie my shoe the car goes down so much! I was trying to go a cheaper route and I'm just gonna stop trying to do that and get the kit.

    Can you only use the 2001 kia rio front strut mount and not any other years? I assume so but if you can get others I can look more!

    Leave a comment:

  • Advancedynamix
    Modifier

  • Advancedynamix
    replied
    The lowest I've gotten the strut mounts was 14 a piece from Rockauto about 2 years ago. I stocked up and bought 20 of them. I'm out now though, lol. 20 a piece is a good price. The Monroe parts seem to be lower priced than the KYB, and a decent quality part.

    Leave a comment:

  • mikemounlio
    Senior Member

  • mikemounlio
    replied
    Spend the money once buddy! Get the kit! You can change it up a bit and try something new if you want. The kit however is amazing. Its so so good man. The festiva handles better then anything on this kit. I had like 500$ in the kit before i sold some non used parts.

    Its the best 500$ i have ever spent moding a car.

    Leave a comment:

  • blake4591
    I'm A Donator!

  • blake4591
    replied
    Originally posted by Advancedynamix View Post
    You'll still need to get sleeves/adjusters for the front, and top spring hats. Then you'll need to cut off the existing spring perch. After all that, plus shipping on those shocks and you'll be within 50 bucks of the threaded body shocks. The quality and servicablity (the eBay coilovers can be rebuilt) of the threaded body coilovers is worth the extra 50 bucks. Not to mention you will have more adjustable travel with the threaded body shocks.
    In addition to this the mk3 KYB struts are about 1" to 2" longer when fully compressed than the hottuning coil overs. I had a set of each and did some side by side comparisons about 6 months ago. I don't think I have any pictures but if I have the coilovers off my car this winter I will get some pictures.

    Leave a comment:

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